The General Conversation Section – If You Don’t Know Where to Say it, Say it Here!
This is the General Conversation Section.
If You Don’t Know Where to Say it, Say it Here!
Under this section you can discuss anything you want.
It can be a Q & A section or a ‘Have you heard’ section…
But please do try and stick to commenting under the relevant Article before commenting here.
The concept of God must be defined. Many talks about god but they talk of a very different god. Therefore it is important that we know Him by name. The name of God Most High the one and only.
Associating God with the Olumpics is bad news.
The olympics is dedicated to Zeus and he is not Almighty God.
What is the real name of the Living Almighty Most High God?
harry
>> The concept of God must be defined…… therefore it is important that we know Him by name. The name of God Most High the one and only…….What is the real name of the Living Almighty Most High God?
Nope harry, that’s not the point, Satan will counterfeit everything that God does, he even uses the name of Jesus for his own purposes. You need to be GENUINELY SAVED and receive the Holy Spirit in order to know the REAL GOD OF THE BIBLE. Please read this article which explains how the Biblcal Holy Spirit works compared to the Unholy Spirit Fire.
what I meant here was that all religions talks about “god” but this god is not the same as the Almighty God. We had the case where a Hindu prayed and I knew that he was not praying to the same God who created the heavens. The propblem is others do not know this even if they are Godfearing Christians. Many people are still being deceived becuase of a lack of knowledge. This is one of them. Satan uses the word “god” for all and not the true and holy Name of Him El Elyon.By using “god” he can unite them all under one word or deity. that is why we must educate and pray and teach truth vs satan.
Harry
Are you caught up in what is called the ‘Hebrew Roots movement’? The premise of the Hebrew Roots movement is the belief that the Church has veered far from the true teachings and Hebrew concepts of the Bible. The movement maintains that Christianity has been indoctrinated with the culture and beliefs of Greek and Roman philosophy and that ultimately biblical Christianity, taught in churches today, has been corrupted with a pagan imitation of the New Testament gospels. Hebrew Rooters have the assumption that the Church has lost its Jewish roots and is unaware that Jesus and His disciples were Jews living in obedience to the Torah.
>> Yet the Ten Commandments and other laws are still standing.
They are all repeated in the new Testament by the Apostles.
What other laws??? Hebrew Rooters involved advocate the need for every believer to walk a Torah-observant life. This means that the ordinances of the Mosaic Covenant must be a central focus in the lifestyle of believers today as it was with the Old Testament Jews of Israel. Keeping the Torah includes keeping the Sabbath on the seventh day of the week (Saturday), celebrating the Jewish feasts and festivals, keeping the dietary laws and learning to understand the Scriptures from a Hebrew mindset. They teach that Gentile Christians have been grafted into Israel, and this is one reason every born-again believer in Jesus the Messiah is to participate in these observances.
Hebrew Rooters also seem to think that every name in the bible is now not good enough to say in English and must be said in Hebrew…So the name of Jesus is not good enough, it must be Yeshua for instance…hmmm.
Harry, do you keep the sabbath?
The Hebrew Roots movement fall into the track of legalism, a separate area part from the Hebrew Roots Movement is the Sacred name movement or the ebyonites who believe that the name of Jesus is a curruption from the word Zues so when you pray you should pray Yehosua.
This is rubbish and nothing more then superstitious I had one guy tell me when if you pray to Jesus your praying to Satan.
Any way I found a good site on this
The sacred name movement is a religious movement which began in the late 1920s and early 1930s. It grew out of division within the Church of God, Seventh Day.
The primary and therefore the namesake concern of this movement is both the written and the oral use of the name Yahweh, or one of the other many English forms of the Hebrew name of God. From this emphasis derives the name, Sacred Name Movement.
While the most popular English form of the Name comes to us as Yahweh (Yahshua for Jesus), in Hebrew Bibles it is hwhy and in early Hebrew manuscripts and engravings, hwhy. By most scholars, it is represented in English as YHWH. By some YHVH.
For many sacred name people, a secondary concern is the disparagement, in varying degrees, of the name of Jesus. This disparagement extends to Chr_stians and Chr_stianity (sic) for refusing to use the Hebrew only sacred names and for being full of pagan practices.
ERROR # 1
THE ORIGINAL PRONUNCIATION OF THE
TETRAGRAMMATON CAN BE DETERMINED
WITH ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY.
Many sacred name teachers believe and very vocally teach that unless one uses the Hebrew name and only the Hebrew name for God, he or she will be eternally damned. It should be noted that not all sacred name teachers are so dogmatic.
While this exclusive view is taken by most SN teachers, they themselves do not know the original Hebrew pronunciation of God’s name. They admit as much by the variety of names used within the movement and by individuals repeatedly changing the name they hold sacred.
By some sacred name people, our Creator is called Yah Veh, Yahh, Yahweh, Iahueh, Yahwah, and Yaohu. By others he is spoken of as Yahuwah, Yahuah, and more than a score of even less likely names.
Jesus is called Yahshua by most sacred name folks. But, more and more are beginning to use Yahushua. By some he is called Yasha, by some Yeshua, by some Yaohushua, by some Y’shua, by some Iahushua, by others Yehoshua, YAHVAHSHUA, and even Yhwhhoshua.
Confusion! Error!
ERROR # 1
THE ORIGINAL PRONUNCIATION OF THE
TETRAGRAMMATON CAN BE DETERMINED
WITH ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY.
Many sacred name teachers believe and very vocally teach that unless one uses the Hebrew name and only the Hebrew name for God, he or she will be eternally damned. It should be noted that not all sacred name teachers are so dogmatic.
While this exclusive view is taken by most SN teachers, they themselves do not know the original Hebrew pronunciation of God’s name. They admit as much by the variety of names used within the movement and by individuals repeatedly changing the name they hold sacred.
By some sacred name people, our Creator is called Yah Veh, Yahh, Yahweh, Iahueh, Yahwah, and Yaohu. By others he is spoken of as Yahuwah, Yahuah, and more than a score of even less likely names.
Jesus is called Yahshua by most sacred name folks. But, more and more are beginning to use Yahushua. By some he is called Yasha, by some Yeshua, by some Yaohushua, by some Y’shua, by some Iahushua, by others Yehoshua, YAHVAHSHUA, and even Yhwhhoshua.
Confusion! Error!
JESUS SPOKE THE NAME YAHWEH
One of the keystone doctrines of the sacred name movement is that our Savior preached and taught the name Yahweh to the Jewish people of his time. One or another sacred name group may say Jesus taught one or another of the numerous possible English transliterations of hwhy. Numbers of sacred name people believe the primary mission of Jesus was bringing the name Yahweh to the world.
It is supposed that the Messiah spoke this name often to the Jewish people, taught the importance and pronunciation of this name to his followers, said it and read it when he referred to the Old Testament, and used this name when he addressed God. Sacred name teachers boldly assert that Jesus was arrested, tried, and killed because he said the name Yahweh.
Are these claims true? Did Jesus ever once utter the name Yahweh? Sacred name teachers gamely admit that according to what is written in the Holy Scriptures he did not. However, they believe the Scriptures are wrong.
Welcome to the sacred name movement.
ERROR # 5
THE NAME JESUS ETYMOLOGICALLY
DERIVES FROM THE NAME ZEUS.
A long held and regularly used false teaching among more than half of sacred name movement assemblies and individuals is that the Greek word for Jesus means son of Zeus or has a meaning otherwise connected with or derived from the word Zeus. There are a number of variations on this fanciful teaching, a favorite being that Jesus means Healing Zeus.
It is especially sad to see sacred name converts, who have no idea of the source of their information, promoting this error.
In spite of the fact that the teaching cannot be backed by research, many in the movement believe it simply has to be true.
The teaching is purely and simply a lie, a fabrication. This falsehood began in the teachings of some of the pioneer preachers of the movement. It continues among preachers and teachers who are movers and shakers in the movement today.
This doctrine and its continued propagation epitomize other false teachings of the sacred name movement. Even after it has time and again been proven false, many still cling to it.
Thanks Miguel!
Deborah
I have my own view on my faith and I do what is expected from me acording to the Word of God. I do not agree with most people and not with the hebrew roots. How sure are you that you are on the right track. After all that I have read here aperson is completely lost if they listen to anyone who does not agree with you.
I believe God and the Word of God. The whole of the Bible is his laws and commandments and my news for the future. I read and follow that and will lsiten to someone and test it with the word and reject if the word does not agree with it.
I have no holier than thou image and will not judge anyone on what they preach. I will just reject it and ignore it in the future. The Holy spirit is my teacher and not the views of man.
What is wrong with keeping the Sabbath and what is wrong in keeping Pesach and Sukkot or even any one of the feasts of God. Be carefull what people say is cancelled that is NOT in the Word of God. Paul said that Jew and gentile is one in Messiah. The word of God is clear, if they want to cancel things then so be it. Just do not judge me if I can’t find the cancellation in the Word of God. Each to his own interpretation as well. You interpret it like this they interpret it like that.
I do agree that there are certain views / interpretations that is far gone and those I will reject because there is written proof that they are wrong.
I keep the feasts of God not the Jewish feast and I keep Sabbath as it also existed before the Ten Commandments. I do not keep christmas and Easter that is evil days that was taken into the church.pagan worshippers.
I believe that Jesus Chirst is the son of the Living God and that He died for my sins and for the salvation of the world. I believe that i must be born again and that I must be baptized in water. And so I do.
If its not in the Bible its not good.
harry
>> not with the hebrew roots
You lie, you do..
Have you ever read Galations? Do yourself a favour…
You have no right to call me a liar.
I have notning to do with them and have not been in contact with them.
I do not know what they teach or preach.
You do not know me.
Do yourself a favour and stop judging!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Harry
Please pay attention, ‘Hebrew Roots’ is not an organisation but a DOCTRINE. What you do, as a GENTILE following JEWISH LAW is termed as Hebrew Root theology.
Now, I am not judging you Haryy, get a grip of yourself, I am pointing out the facts here. Did you go and read Galations? I bet you didn’t. Let me help you out and point out that just because it’s IN THE BIBLE Harry, as you stated, does not mean you as a Christian now have to DO IT.
Galatians 3:1-14
Justification by Faith
3 O foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you that you should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed among you as crucified? 2 This only I want to learn from you: Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3 Are you so foolish? Having begun in the Spirit, are you now being made perfect by the flesh? 4 Have you suffered so many things in vain—if indeed it was in vain?
5 Therefore He who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you, does He do it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?— 6 just as Abraham “believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.” 7 Therefore know that only those who are of faith are sons of Abraham. 8 And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, “In you all the nations shall be blessed.” 9 So then those who are of faith are blessed with believing Abraham.
The Law Brings a Curse
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.” 11 But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God is evident, for “the just shall live by faith.” 12 Yet the law is not of faith, but “the man who does them shall live by them.”
13 Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree”, 14 that the blessing of Abraham might come upon the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
Now Harry, so you see that as a Gentile you are to BELIEVE BY FAITH? and that you are CURSED if you follow the LAW. Jesus died to FULLFILL the LAW Harry, and you are making a mockery of Him, buy not believing in FAITH but instead following the LAW which JESUS came to fullfill.
The 10 Commandments are written into our minds and our hearts:
Hebrews 8:10
10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.
2 Corinthians 3:6
6 who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.
The 10 commandments are written into our hearts Harry when we become children of God… but what about the SABBATH? Well this is very simple to answer Harry in light of what Galations 3 says.
THIS is the Gospel Truth of the matter:
1) Jesus Christ kept the Sabbath because HE WAS THE LAW – (Jesus Christ kept the Sabbath because HE, was the Law of the Sabbath.)
2) Jesus Christ taught the Sabbath by having kept the Sabbath because he was still on earth and Lord of the Sabbath Day on earth.
3) When Jesus was crucified many miraculous things took place, one of these being that Jesus Christ fulfilled the Law and it was written in our hearts (all 10 commandments)
4) Jesus became our Sabbath REST in all born again Christians – we do not need to WORK anymore to keep this commandment because the HOLY SPIRIT now abides in each and every born again believer.
Hence all truly born again believers keep all 10 commandants.
If you keep the Sabbath Harry, you are dishonoring Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit that abides in you because Jesus is your REST. By keeping any LAW you are in effect saying that you are not interested in the fact that Jesus came to die for you. You prefer the OLD COVENANT, and not the NEW COVENANT that Jesus Christ has given you.
The bible has some HARSH WORDS for people like yourself Harry, for trying to be a Jew when you are not (READ GALATIONS AGAIN Harry)
Revelation 2:9
9 “I know your works, tribulation, and poverty (but you are rich); and I know the blasphemy of those who say they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan.
Now Harry, the problem here is a big one, because you either have the Holy Spirit ABIDING in you and HE will chastise you, warn you, that what you are doing is wrong and you need to stop and BELIEVE JESUS THROUGH FAITH AND FAITH ALONE. Or you carry on in your ways and follow false doctrine.
I have given you enough biblical proof, to prove that you are on the wrong track and I SINCERELY PRAY that you listen to the Holy Spirit’s voice on this matter and change your ways, instead of being cursed.
Deborah,thanks for revealing these things.We seemingly caught up in things that are designed in such a way that we fit ourselves in,thinking that we know whats happening but only to find that there is hidden agenda to what we have involved our selves in and that we don’t know and don’t want to be a part of it.Sport has chosen as one of the things that unites people.In a South African soccer world cup there was lots of occult signs than u can count,even the death of Mr Mandela’s grand daughter it is said that it was a sacrifice by Mandela to the god of darkness which is satan.So sport is one way of uniting people in error.Thanks again Deborah.
Who said that I am a gentile?
You do not know me.
I am blessed not cursed and I am closer to God than ever before.
I am blessed every day and the Spirit of God abides in me.
even if the law is written in your heart it is still there.
Even Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath and therefore I honor him by keeping to his sabbath.
The Holy Spirit protects and keeps me.
“He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.” (I John 2:4)
He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.John 14:21
Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.Rev22:14
For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus…. And if ye be Christ’s, then are ye Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.” (Gal. 3:26,29).
Rev. 14:12 “Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.”
I rest my case
Goodbye
I am blessed and saved.
Will not argue with you on this any longer,
Harry
Even if you were Jewish Harry, when you get saved you are to MOVE AWAY FROM THE LAW because you now fall under the NEW COVENANT and you are JUSTIFIED BY FAITH – covered by the Blood of Jesus Christ.
Galations says if you practice one law you need to practice the whole lot, so when are you going to start sacrificing Harry?
You quote the following scriptures
The word commandments here Harry is NOT THE LAW, it’s everything that is contained in the WORD OF GOD, but read in CONTEXT of all scriptures together, not hand picked verses here and there to suit yourself.
You quote this scripture…
I don’t understand, that so many Christians are following the Catholic trend now. Not the belief, but the trend, like Icons, Lectio Devina etc. Do yuo have something about that?
Blessings,
Lis Jensen,
Denmark.
Hi Liz.
It is not so surprising considering the Ecumenical movement and TV Evangelists. Also, when the protestant churches were formed, they still clung and still cling to many R.C. beliefs and trends.
Hi Lis
This is the trend, becuause all religions (including Pentecostals and Charismatics) will lead back to Rome in the Last days (and we are in those Last Days). Read this article about the Vaticans Evangelization plan to convert Pentecostals and Charismatics to Chatholics without them even knowing it. The New Evangelical – Evil fit for a New Dark Age And then you have the Emergent movement who sneaky sneaky brought in things to the church such as Prayer Stations, Lectio Devina, Labyrinths, and much more to snare the Christian into the practice of mystic practices. Then you also have this unholy FIRE that they call down from heaven in pretty much all Pentecostal and Charismatic churches that is being transferred to people at churches and included in this FIRE you hear a lot lately about people speaking about the ‘heart of God’ – well this is all Catholic and this unholy spirit that is falling on people is going to lead people right back to Rome when Rome finally takes it’s stand with iron teeth and forces itself on the world at being the only world Religion. See this article for all the details: The Biblical Holy Spirit vs.The False Unholy Spirit of Fire
I have just finished reading an article on The Berean Call, they are addressing the very same issue=P
I see a trend of a separation of believers becoming more steadfast and the uncertain falling by the wayside into the lost catagory.
Sola Scripture
Topics are often been innundated with irrevelavent data…or so it seems but most of my comments have been aimed at the main core of all spiritual problems. One of them of them has been sadly neglected but it is indeed one of the most important and that is the question of divorce. Such an important subject that the church has got it it all wrong despite the fact that the Saviour Himself gave very clear instructions and so did Apostle Paul. This is a subject that is paramount to all believers and sadly been neglected with the result of far reaching spiritual problems. A topic that should in this context be addressed very sternly and aggresively.
Michael
You are absolutely right, maybe I will do an article on that one soon 🙂
[deleted]
Hello Debs,
I listened to a preacher the other day preach that Hell (the litteral hell the Bible speaks about) is in the Core of planet earth (inner/outer core). He went on to say that the lava and gas that come out of volcanic eruptions are actually hell fire from the core of earth.
Of course he gave full proof with Bible verses and such. I left very puzzled as I am not fully convinced. I will re-listen to the sermon and I will post his Bible references here. I need to study the subject by myself and let the HS guide me into the truth about IS THE PHYSICAL LOCATION OF HELL REVEALED IN SCRIPTURE AND IF YES, WHERE IS IT SITUATED ?
Paul
Paul
That is a good question. Is the physical location of hell revealed in scripture… I have no idea, it’s not something I have looked into.
Please post that guys bible references, because it would be interesting to see.
I want to know…who’s the guy? That will tell a lot!
Sequel of my above comment about Volcanoes and Hell :
I want to say that this preacher is a beloved brother. Yet this does not mean that he cannot be in error, in which case we need to approach him with love and point his error (if it is the case) so that he will correct it and not spread it. Until a person is found to be a wolf in sheep’s clothing (ie a false brother), I believe we should not expose his errors and name him in public without having contacted him and given him the opportunity to explain and/or correct himself.
Here are the 8 KJV references this preacher used to prove his doctrine of Hell being in the core of planet earth:
#1 Isaiah 14:9-15
(9) Hell from beneath is moved for thee to meet thee at thy coming: it stirreth up the dead for thee, even all the chief ones of the earth; it hath raised up from their thrones all the kings of the nations.
(10) All they shall speak and say unto thee, Art thou also become weak as we? art thou become like unto us?
(11) Thy pomp is brought down to the grave, and the noise of thy viols: the worm is spread under thee, and the worms cover thee.
(12) How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
(13) For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
(14) I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
(15) Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.
#2 Pro 15:24 The way of life is above to the wise, that he may depart from hell beneath.
#3 Deu 32:22 For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains.
(Note: “Set on fire the foundations of the mountains” is interpreted as volcanic eruptions)
#4 Isaiah 5:14-15
(14) Therefore hell hath enlarged herself, and opened her mouth without measure: and their glory, and their multitude, and their pomp, and he that rejoiceth, shall descend into it.
(15) And the mean man shall be brought down, and the mighty man shall be humbled, and the eyes of the lofty shall be humbled:
(Note: Hell is ever enlarging itself to contain the multitudes who die without Christ)
#5 Ezekiel 31:14-18
(14) To the end that none of all the trees by the waters exalt themselves for their height, neither shoot up their top among the thick boughs, neither their trees stand up in their height, all that drink water: for they are all delivered unto death, to the nether parts of the earth, in the midst of the children of men, with them that go down to the pit.
(15) Thus saith the Lord GOD; In the day when he went down to the grave I caused a mourning: I covered the deep for him, and I restrained the floods thereof, and the great waters were stayed: and I caused Lebanon to mourn for him, and all the trees of the field fainted for him.
(16) I made the nations to shake at the sound of his fall, when I cast him down to hell with them that descend into the pit: and all the trees of Eden, the choice and best of Lebanon, all that drink water, shall be comforted in the nether parts of the earth.
(17) They also went down into hell with him unto them that be slain with the sword; and they that were his arm, that dwelt under his shadow in the midst of the heathen.
(18) To whom art thou thus like in glory and in greatness among the trees of Eden? yet shalt thou be brought down with the trees of Eden unto the nether parts of the earth: thou shalt lie in the midst of the uncircumcised with them that be slain by the sword. This is Pharaoh and all his multitude, saith the Lord GOD.
(Note: “the nether parts of the earth” means “the heart of the womb of the earth”)
#6 Numbers 16:30-35
(30) But if the LORD make a new thing, and the earth open her mouth, and swallow them up, with all that appertain unto them, and they go down quick into the pit; then ye shall understand that these men have provoked the LORD.
(31) And it came to pass, as he had made an end of speaking all these words, that the ground clave asunder that was under them:
(32) And the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed them up, and their houses, and all the men that appertained unto Korah, and all their goods.
(33) They, and all that appertained to them, went down alive into the pit, and the earth closed upon them: and they perished from among the congregation.
(34) And all Israel that were round about them fled at the cry of them: for they said, Lest the earth swallow us up also.
(35) And there came out a fire from the LORD, and consumed the two hundred and fifty men that offered incense.
#7 Luke 16:19-26
(19) There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day:
(20) And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores,
(21) And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man’s table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.
(22) And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham’s bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
(23) And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
(24) And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
(25) But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.
(26) And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.
#8 Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Nice addition! What’s your opinion on ‘eyewitness’ accounts of those who ‘went’ to hell and back? it’s slightly on the rise here in Naija and the surprising thing is, these accounts match despite the time line and the different geographical locations. Just curious!
Sadly, despite the vast amount of very useful information available here, I am still deeply saddened by what I see here.
I have to agree with Paul’s opening sentence above. Humans, and that includes Christians, will get things wrong sometimes. Even those who have been given authority by God. Luckily, though, we (all born-again Christians) have the Holy Spirit to teach us right from wrong. After all, Scripture teaches us not to trust princes (Ps. 145:3) and that we need no teacher other than the Holy Spirit:
“But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, HE WILL TEACH YOU ALL THINGS, and bring to your remembrance all things that I have said to you.” (John 14:26)
“However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, HE WILL GUIDE YOU INTO ALL TRUTH …” (JOHN 16:13)
Lastly, I would like to know how discernment is defined here? I seem to see so many references to study and research that it almost appears as if that is the basis of it (but that might be a skewed impression)?
Hanelie
Firstly I am sure Paul is speaking about a genuine Christian who is preaching on something that will not affect ones FAITH or SALVATION etc. There is a difference between someone preaching blatant false teaching and following a completely different gospel other than the one preached by Jesus Christ, to making a slight mistake on something very very small.
>> Lastly, I would like to know how discernment is defined here?
Discernment comes by the Holy Spirit and Holy Spirit only.
John 14:26; “But the Comforter, who is the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.”
John 16:13; “However, when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will show you things to come.”
Are we to study to find ourselves approved? Be like the BEARENS were who studied the scriptures day and night?
2 Timothy; 2:15 “Study to show yourself approved to God, a workman that needs not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.”
Acts 17:11; “These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.”
Everyone on this website that has been exposed, have been exposed because their entire doctrine, everything they believe in is false, not just a little bitty bit of it that needs correction. No their entire beliefs are twisted around a false gospel and they are preaching this false gospel to thousands of other people, and leading multitudes to hell.
There is a new kinda love today and it is one that says that “Brotherly love goes deeper than doctrine”, that we must all just accept each others views and then hug each other and hopefully someone will change – but to which side no one knows. We all know which way the world is heading so one can clearly make a bet and say the huggers will succumb to the Emergent way of love and unity and it’s false teaching very quickly.
Genuine LOVE is preaching the gospel truth and nothing but the truth to those in serious error, and they will fight and shout and kick and scream, but it if they refuse to listen, (John 3:20; “20 For everyone that does evil hates the light, neither comes to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed.” ) it shows that there is no light in them. As for the people who listen to the false teachers and prophets that need to hear the truth, the same goes for them. Many are caught up in a trap and need a way to escape and reading the truth about the teachings of their so called prophet or Apostle has helped many get on their knees and seek Jesus Christ in earnest.
What does the bible say we must do about these people who are causing such harm to the body of Christ?
Mark Them Which Cause Division
Romans 16:17-18 “17Now I beseech you, brethren, MARK THEN which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. 18For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.”
Do Not Tolerate Wicked People
Revelation 2:2-3 (Amp) “2 I know your industry and activities, laborious toil and trouble, and your patient endurance, and how you cannot tolerate wicked [men] and have tested and critically appraised those who call [themselves] apostles (special messengers of Christ) and YET ARE NOT, and have found them to be IMPOSTORS AND LIARS. 3 I know you are enduring patiently and are bearing up for My name’s sake, and you have not fainted or become exhausted or grown weary.”
1. Clearly tells us we are not to tolerate wicked men
2. Clearly tells us we are to TEST (1 John 4:1-6)
3. Clearly tells us we are to CRITICALLY APPRAISE
4. Jesus warns us about these so called ‘apostles’ who are nothing but liars and impostors.
4 We are told to MARK those who cause division (Romans 16:17-18)
As Christians We Must Judge Righteously
As Christians we do not judge a person’s life, i.e., sin, because we are all sinners (Matt 7:1)., we judge righteously according to the Word of God. The Bible commands us to judge fellow Christians teachings and their fruit. Those in the church we are to judge according to the Word of God. Those outside of the church we show them the error of their ways, preach the gospel to them and then leave them in God’s hands. We are also commanded to judge/test their teachings/doctrine to make sure it is correct and that it ties up with scripture.
There are many verses in the bible where we are told to JUDGE/TEST:
1 Thessalonians 5:21 (Amp); “21But test and prove all things [until you can recognize] what is good; [to that] hold fast.”
Matthew 7:15-20 (Amp); “15Beware of false prophets, who come to you dressed as sheep, but inside they are devouring wolves. 16You will fully recognize them by their fruits. Do people pick grapes from thorns, or figs from thistles? 17Even so, every healthy (sound) tree bears good fruit [worthy of admiration], but the sickly (decaying, worthless) tree bears bad (worthless) fruit. 18A good (healthy) tree cannot bear bad (worthless) fruit, nor can a bad (diseased) tree bear [excellent fruit [worthy of admiration]. 19Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and cast into the fire. 20Therefore, you will fully know them by their fruits.”
1 Corinthians 5:12-13 (Amp); “12What [business] of mine is it and what right have I to judge outsiders? Is it not those inside [the church] upon whom you are to pass disciplinary judgment [passing censuring sentence on them as the facts require]? 13God alone sits in judgment on those who are outside. Drive out that wicked one from among you [expel him from your church].”
1 Corinthians 14:29 (Amp); “29 So let two or three prophets speak [those inspired to preach or teach], while the rest pay attention and weigh and discern what is said.”
John 7:24 (Amp;) “24Be honest in your judgment and do not decide at a glance (superficially and by appearances); but judge fairly and righteously.”
Titus 1:9-16 (Amp;) “9He must hold fast to the sure and trustworthy Word of God as he was taught it, so that he may be able both to give stimulating instruction and encouragement in sound (wholesome) doctrine and to refute and convict those who contradict and oppose it [showing the wayward their error]. 10For there are many disorderly and unruly men who are idle (vain, empty) and misleading talkers and self-deceivers and deceivers of others. [This is true] especially of those of the circumcision party [who have come over from Judaism]. 11Their mouths must be stopped, for they are mentally distressing and subverting whole families by teaching what they ought not to teach, for the purpose of getting base advantage and disreputable gain. 12One of their [very] number, a prophet of their own, said, Cretans are always liars, hurtful beasts, idle and lazy gluttons. 13And this account of them is [really] true. Because it is [true], rebuke them sharply [deal sternly, even severely with them], so that they may be sound in the faith and free from error, 14[And may show their soundness by] ceasing to give attention to Jewish myths and fables or to rules [laid down] by [mere] men who reject and turn their backs on the Truth. 15To the pure [in heart and conscience] all things are pure, but to the defiled and corrupt and unbelieving nothing is pure; their very minds and consciences are defiled and polluted. 16They profess to know God [to recognize, perceive, and be acquainted with Him], but deny and disown and renounce Him by what they do; they are detestable and loathsome, unbelieving and disobedient and disloyal and rebellious, and [they are] unfit and worthless for good work (deed or enterprise) of any kind.”
1 John 4 (Amp); “1BELOVED, DO not put faith in every spirit, but prove (test) the spirits to discover whether they proceed from God; for many false prophets have gone forth into the world.”
Thank you for the detailed response to my question, Deborah.
Deborah (Discerning the World) wrote:
That is what I had assumed too.
Deborah (Discerning the World) wrote:
But, when is it very, very small, and when not? When Paul was corrected by Peter, was his mistake very, very small? Or could it possibly have mislead the Jewish believers? If it was so small (as to insignificant), why did Paul correct him publicly? If we want to be technical about it, Peter was “teaching and following a completely different gospel other than the one preached by Jesus Christ”, but did that make him a false prophet (apostel)? Surely not.
Hanelie
Small in my mind would be for instance, where is hell? I mean, where is hell… if it’s in the middle of the earth our out somewhere in the universe it does not matter. Will it mislead people into believing an entirely false gospel? Well that all depends on who is doing the preaching and what the rest of his ‘beliefs’ look like. If he distorts what hell is and who it’s meant for etc, then we need to wave a big red flag. Now please I am using this example of ‘where hell is” as an EXAMPLE. I have not ‘studied to show myself approved’ on this subject (I am busy researching it at the moment) so don’t know the answer as yet, it could very well be a major issue and lead off into a whole other doctrine I am unaware of – and I am sure there is just someone out there who is just waiting to jump down my throat because of this.
So, going back to your first comment you said, “I am still deeply saddened by what I see here……..Humans, and that includes Christians, will get things wrong sometimes.” and now your second comment, “But, when is it very, very small, and when not? When Paul was corrected by Peter, was his mistake very, very small?……If it was so small (as to insignificant), why did Paul correct him publicly?”
I’mmmmmmm just a little confused as to what you are trying to ask me. You are giving me mixed messages.