Biblical Holy Spirit vs. Unholy Spirit of Fire
Holy Spirit vs. Filthy Spirit of Fire, the calling down of Fire from heaven over a congregation, or praying Fire over someone is the norm in the church today. It has come to resemble the early heretic Gnostic churches. Religious ecstasy (or Kundalini) was to be found in the mystery religions of the first century A.D. Back when the Corinth church seemed to be a hub of pagan Gnostic knowledge and ran rampant in unscriptural and immoral practices; the Greek mystery religions had prophets who babbled in unknown tongues which were caused by a Kundalini awakening.
Below is a table explaining the differences between The Biblical Holy Spirit compared to The Kundalini unholy spirit that masquerades as the Biblical Holy Spirit. This table is exhaustive and contains everything you need to know:
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Holy Spirit |
Kundalini Unholy Spirit of Fire |
Who is the Holy Spirit? |
Who is the Kundalini unholy spirit? |
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How do we receive the Holy Spirit |
How do we get this unholy spirit? |
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** Through the false ‘Baptism of the unholy Spirit’.** The calling down of Fire (Serpent Fire).
** Being filled with the Unholy Ghost by Fire.
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Are there any happenings that go with the filling of the Holy Spirit? |
Are there any feelings or happenings that go with this filling of the unholy spirit? |
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What does ‘Walking in the Spirit’ mean?. What does being “Filled by the Holy Spirit’ mean? |
What happens when we have opened our Third Eye? (6th Chakra) |
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Evidence or Signs: |
False Signs and Wonders: |
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This Kundalini spirit is found in all religions across the world just under different names:
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False ‘unholy spirit fire‘ in action masquerading as Holy Spirit:
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PLEASE WATCH VIDEO |
PLEASE WATCH VIDEO |
Montanism
Montanism was an early Gnostic so called Christian movement of the late 2nd century, later referred to by the name of its founder, Montanus, but originally known by its adherents as the New Prophecy (or ‘The Phyrgian Heresy’) . The heretical movement spread rapidly to other regions in the Roman Empire at a time before Christianity was generally tolerated or legal. It persisted in some isolated places into the 6th century.
It was a prophetic movement that called for a reliance on the spontaneity of the Holy Spirit and spoke extra biblical revelation. Parallels have been made between Montanism and modern day movements such as the charismatic movement, and the New Apostolic Reformation (NAR). [1]
As the name “New Prophecy” implied, Montanism was a movement focused around prophecy, specifically those of the movement’s founders which were believed to contain the Holy Spirit’s revelation for the present age.[2] New Prophecy departed from Church tradition as described by Eusebius of Caesarea [3]: “And he [Montanus] became beside himself, and being suddenly in a sort of frenzy and ecstasy, he raved, and began to babble and utter strange things, prophesying in a manner contrary to the constant custom of the Church handed down by tradition from the beginning.”[4]
The Montanist prophets did not speak as messengers of God but were described as possessed by God while being unable to resist. Montanists believed that the new prophecies superseded and fulfilled the doctrines proclaimed by the Apostles.[5] Thus, they were seen as false prophets because they acted irrationally and were not in control of their senses.[6]
The Roman Catholic unholy spirit of FIRE
The church has gone so far with this unholy fire that it has literally ENGULFED the entire church. You need to be permanently on FIRE for God according to the powers that be (TBN (Trinity Broadcasting Network), God TV, Rodney Howard-Browne, Kenneth Copeland, Angus Buchan, Rick Joyner, Ray McCauley, Cindy Jacobs, Deon Hockey, Kim Clement, Marc Bredenkamp, Leon du Preez, Harold Weitsz, et al.) as they spell out their incantation and throw FIRE, FIRE, and more FIRE in the congregations direction. Those in the congregation who have experienced this religious ecstasy want more, and those who have not experienced it, want to experience it because they believe this is the Holy Spirit as work.
The ‘Heart of God is now on FIRE‘ and everyone is pushed in this direction by the church to get to know ‘God’s heart‘. What they don’t tell you is that this ‘Heart of God’ is the Roman Catholic Sacred Heart of Jesus, and it is also the Immaculate Heart of Mary.
The church as it currently stands is being shoved towards pagan ROME at a rapid speed. But in order for Pentecostals and Charismatics to accept Roman Catholicism they would first have to accept the ‘spirit‘ by which it operates. Rome’s EVANGELIZATION of non-Catholics started decades ago, and their hard labour has paid off. Just as the ancient Egyptians viewed Kundalini as being ‘Ra‘ who is symbolized as the sun because the sun is the source of kundalini energy. So does the Roman Catholic Church who, worships the Sun god Mithra (incarnation of Ra).
Let’s have a look and see that the bible says about “fire called down from heaven” in the New Testament.
Revelation 13:13 “he [antichrist] doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,”
G4442 πῦρ pur (pïr’) n.
fire.
{literally or figuratively}
This fire is spiritual and literal. In the last days, the antichrist, the false Church, and it’s followers call down spiritual FIRE from heaven onto earth – this fire is satanic, it’s captures your soul with fake love and false manifestations that capture your mind. The antichrist will also bring down real fire from heaven in the sight of me to deceive them.
Was fire ever called down from heaven when Jesus walked the earth? Nope, how do we know? Well let’s go to God’s Word…look at this:
During Jesus’ earthly ministry, the disciples James and John wanted to call down fire from heaven in judgment of a Samaritan village that did not welcome the Lord Jesus Christ. What did Jesus Christ say to his disciples?
Luke 9:55- “But He turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of.“
As we can clearly see from the bible, this spirit is from Satan, and is NOT the Holy Spirit. Jesus had not come “to condemn the world, but to save the world” (John 3:17)
This ‘fire that is called down from heaven’ is from Satan, another spirit, an unholy spirit – that condemns you.
[Edited 5 Oct 2018: I’ve added this to explain the above in more detail because of this comment: 2018/10/05 at 3:17 pm:
Please note I am not saying that God did not ever use fire to destroy wickedness.
In the verses Luke 9:54-56 Jesus rebukes his disciples for trying to call down fire from heaven, why? Jesus would never rebuke Elijah for what he did in calling down fire to destroy wickedness, if He did He would be rebuking the Father Himself as God rained fire and brimstone down on Sodom and Gomorrah and surrounding towns. One needs to compare OT to NT. Different dispensations.
What do the words “You know not what manner of spirit you are of.” mean? James and John in all their faithful zeal to Jesus Christ thought they were doing a good thing by wanting to destroy the wicked town that rejected Jesus by doing as Elijah did when he called down fire under OT Law. However the Apostles in training as I call them (Peter, James, John) had just recently seen Moses and Elias speaking with Jesus on the Mount of Transfiguration. So James and John, thinking they could copy Elijah, where wrong in their thinking, and were in fact sinning when they wanted to call down fire, because they did not understand and they were under grace and Jesus didn’t operate like that. That is why Jesus rebuked them.
Anyone who wants to call down fire (be it physical fire or spiritual fire to destroy the soul) in this age of grace has a spirit of vengeance and it’s not from God.
This fire is a counterfeit. It’s a fire that leads to the UNITY of all religions, the joining of Protestant and Catholic, a co-reformation – into the false Christian church we have today. ]
2018: Year of the Holy Ghost and Fire by Kenneth Copeland
Please read the full comment where I give a transcript from Kenneth Copeland on what ‘burning the chaff’ means in his dictionary.
Charles Spurgeon
And if you think calling down fire is limited to only Charismatics? Think again. The so called ‘Prince of Preachers’ of Calvinism, Charles Spurgeon himself called down demonic Kunalini fire.
Holy Fire / Divine Fire / Heart of Flame
Holy Fire
Charles Spurgeon: “The church needs fire to quicken her ministers, to give zeal and energy to all her members. Having this fire, she burns her way to success! The world meets her with the fire of firewood, but she confronts the world with the fire of kindling spirits, and of souls aglow with the love of Jesus Christ. She trusts not to the wit, and eloquence, and wisdom of her preachers, but to the divine fire which clothes them with energy! She knows that men are irresistible when they are filled with hallowed enthusiasm sent from God. She trusts therefore in this, and her cry is, “Come, Holy Fire, abide upon our pastors and teachers! Rest upon every one of us!” —The Superlative Excellence of the Holy Spirit #574 https://www.spurgeongems.org/vols10-12/chs574.pdf
Divine Fire
Charles Spurgeon: “Brothers, I beseech you keep to the old gospel, and let your souls be filled with it, and then may you be set on fire with it! When the wick is saturated, let the flame be applied. Fire from Heaven is still the necessity of the age. They call it “go”, and there is nothing which goes like it; for when fire once starts upon a vast prairie or forest, all that is dry and withered must disappear before its terrible advance. May God Himself, who is a consuming fire, ever burn in you as in the bush at Horeb! All other things being equal, that man will do most who has most of the Divine fire.” — How to Meet the Evils of the Age Chapter 4 https://archive.spurgeon.org/misc/aarm04.php
Occult teaching on Holy fire and Divine fire
Theosophy: “In a certain sense, the task before the disciple is the evocation of the “divine fire“, Kundalini, and the infusion of the principle of Will in him by that divine fire; the golden light mingling with the red flame, to produce the colour of the mystic rose. The fiery aspiration of the disciple evokes the higher celestial fire, and the two blend in one, the holy fire which shall thereafter illumine and enkindle that disciple’s heart and life and every act.” –— The Theosophical Quarterly Volumes 17-18 1919 edited by Clement Acton Griscom pg. 226, https://books.google.com/books?id=g3g1AQAAMAAJ
Heart of Flame (see Roman Catholic Heart of Fire above)
Spurgeon: “But we bless God that there are not so many of that sort, now, and we pray that the race may become quite extinct—and that every pulpit may be filled with a man who has a tongue of fire and a heart of flame and who shuns not to declare the whole counsel of God, neither seeking the smiles of men nor dreading their frowns!” — The Dumb Singing #2625 http://www.spurgeongems.org/vols43-45/chs2625.pdf
Occult teaching on Heart of Flame
Universal Brotherhood (Theosophical teachings):”Then One spoke – He of the mighty arm – He of the eye of power. And He inquired (speaking calm and low, and looking round on all the gathered throng) who would willing go into the world of flesh – to waken all the souls that now could hear, and teach to them the meaning high, sublime, of life; show them the Movement – flowing onward like a river vast, with but one source and end; teach them how to enter on that tide, and moving with Love – and for this Fire Divine in thee thou hast been called ‘The Heart of Flame.” — UNIVERSAL BROTHERHOOD, Volume 15, nos. 7-12, pg. 439-440 https://www.scribd.com/document/37146710/Universal-Brotherhood-v15-n7-12
Salvation or Deliverance
If you need salvation and or deliverance from this false unholy spirit or any other demonic spirit, please read this article: Seeking Salvation or Deliverance.
Here is an excellent article that explains the history, characteristics and fruit of the Vatican Second Council New Evangelization initiative: The New Evangelical – Evil fit for a New Dark Age. See this article on the Roman Catholic goddess Mary (incarnation of Isis, etc) : Mary Queen of Heaven – Whore of Babylon
A collage of images taken from the internet showing an explosion of demonic FIRE. Everything now involves this unholy FIRE; from books, music, banners, posters, tattoos, t-shirts and background pictures for your pc.
Notes:
[1] Robeck, Cecil M., Jr. (2010). “Montanism and Present Day ‘Prophets'”. Pneuma: the Journal of the Society for Pentecostal Studies 32: 413.
[2] Tabbernee, Prophets and Gravestones, p. 68.
[3] Tabbernee, Prophets and Gravestones, pp. 12, 37.
[4] Eusebius of Caesarea, Ecclesiastical History Book 5. Chapter 16. paragraph 7.
[5] a b c Chapman, John (1911). “Montanists”. The Catholic Encyclopedia. 10. Robert Appleton Company. Retrieved 27 June 2011.
[6] Epiphanius, Against Heresies, 48.3-4.
Hi. I hate to sound argumentative, but the comments from “YourConscience” sounded like legitimate arguments to me and they were not really addressed. I saw the conversation in general go into a discussion of worshipping money (which I realize was a comment to a scripture he put up there)… but that seems to be off topic in general. Obviously, every Christian knows that the LOVE of money is the root of all evil. I don’t think that needs to be addressed here, and I seriously doubt that everyone wants to get out their banking info to prove that they have less money than the other to prove their godliness. That would just be ridiculous.
These are the specific scriptures that “YourConscience” cited that I feel still need to be addressed because they weren’t:
I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with Fire: Matthew 3:11 —- Question mainly, if fire is all from satan, what the fire that John is speaking of?
For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence. Acts 1:5 —- Again, this is showing a clear baptism with the Holy Ghost… and the disciples were told not to leave until they had received this. Also, Jesus told them that this would empower them.
There is also this scripture that leads me to believe that the baptism of the Holy Spirit can definitely be a separate event:
Acts 8:14-19
When the apostles in Jerusalem heard that Samaria had “accepted the word of God,” they sent Peter and John to them. When they arrived, they prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit, because the Holy Spirit had not yet come upon any of them; they had simply been baptized into the name of the Lord Jesus. Then Peter and John placed their hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit. When Simon saw that the Spirit was given at the laying on of the apostles’ hands, he offered them money and said, “Give me also this ability so that everyone on whom I lay my hands may receive the Holy Spirit.”
Acts 9:17-20
Then Ananias went to the house and entered it. Placing his hands on Saul, he said, “Brother Saul, the Lord–Jesus, who appeared to you on the road as you were coming here–has sent me so that you may see again and be filled with the Holy Spirit.” Immediately, something like scales fell from Saul’s eyes, and he could see again. He got up and was baptized, and after taking some food, he regained his strength. Saul spent several days with the disciples in Damascus. At once he began to preach in the synagogues that Jesus is the Son of God.
Acts 19:1-6
While Apollos was at Corinth, Paul took the road through the interior and arrived at Ephesus. There he found some disciples and asked them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?” They answered, “No, we have not even heard that there is a Holy Spirit.” So Paul asked, “Then what baptism did you receive?” “John’s baptism,” they replied. Paul said, “John’s baptism was a baptism of repentance. He told the people to believe in the one coming after him, that is, in Jesus.” On hearing this, they were baptized into the name of the Lord Jesus. When Paul placed his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came “on them”, and they spoke in tongues and prophesied.
Acts 11:16-17
“Then I remembered the word of the Lord, how He said, “John indeed baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’ If therefore God gave them the same gift as He gave us when we believed on the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could withstand God?”
Mark 3:20-30
New King James Version (NKJV)
Also there is this scripture… warning us to be very careful upon critisizing the power of God. Thus, what makes me nervous to form too strong of an opinion against the ministries of others where God’s power is displayed… especially when the word says “these signs will follow those who believe.” If someone doesn’t have signs following them, it can only logically make one ask if they really believe… that was said by Jesus himself.
A House Divided Cannot Stand
20 Then the multitude came together again, so that they could not so much as eat bread. 21 But when His own people heard about this, they went out to lay hold of Him, for they said, “He is out of His mind.”
22 And the scribes who came down from Jerusalem said, “He has Beelzebub,” and, “By the ruler of the demons He casts out demons.”
23 So He called them to Himself and said to them in parables: “How can Satan cast out Satan? 24 If a kingdom is divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand. 25 And if a house is divided against itself, that house cannot stand. 26 And if Satan has risen up against himself, and is divided, he cannot stand, but has an end. 27 No one can enter a strong man’s house and plunder his goods, unless he first binds the strong man. And then he will plunder his house.
The Unpardonable Sin
28 “Assuredly, I say to you, all sins will be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they may utter; 29 but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is subject to eternal condemnation”— 30 because they said, “He has an unclean spirit.”
And my speech and my preaching were not with persuasive words of human wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power, — 1 Corinthians 2:4
This is not to unwittingly condemn anyone truly seeking the truth, but obviously there is something to the Holy Spirit. King David dances wildly, so much so that his undergarments are exposed. When his wife hates him because of his highly emotional behaviour towards the Lord, it is a shame on her, not David. Throughout the Bible there are examples nearly too numerous to type here of the supernatural power of God. It knocks men backwards, forwards, and makes them appear drunk to others. Read the books of the prophets, the taking up into the third heaven of the Apostle Paul, the heavenly experiences of John in the Revelation of Jesus Christ… these are just a few examples. God is the same yesterday, today, and forever and He is no respector of persons. He also requests that we earnestly seek and ask for all of the spiritual gifts listed to the Corinthian church. Should we not then seek for and enjoy them… God would not have said that if He doesn’t think we’ll need it. He gives good gifts to His children, and if we ask for bread, God will not give us a stone… He is a good Father.
If you point out the roots of the people who have shaped your faith, I can probably trace them back to someone who believed very much in the supernatural performance of an Almight God who does not need our permission to act out in ways that we may think unconventional. Had I gone to an evangelist when I was sick and asked for healing and they told me to go dip myself in a river three times and be healed, I would have thought that nuts in my natural mind. However, that happened with the leper and Elijah.
My point is, who are WE to tell the Almighty God what His methods should be. Some of the very things you preach against, God’s Word seems to promote. It was Hannah, the mother of Samuel (the one who anointed mighty kings) who prayed so emotionally in the temple that the priest thought she was drunk and nearly cast her out. Emotional is okay. People tore their clothes and fell to the ground in mourning all of the time in the Old Testament to honor God. Had they stood their stoically, scared of what others thought, and unmoved in their hearts, there is no indication that would have been pleasing to God. You can even study ancient worship in the Bible to see that the way God commands us to worship Him is very ecstatic and emotional. Check out the Hebrew words when praise and worship are described… some of them clearly match the definition “to appear insane.”
I was saved in a baptist church, and now I am part of a non-denominational type of church… And I am free in Christ, to dance, to shout, to laugh, to cry, and to be quiet and still in His presence. He leads me in different ways at different times according to His good will. I have no idea what your worship life is like with God… so that may even be a mute point here with me assuming based on previous details of the writing.
However, I do know that Jesus Himself said: “28 “Assuredly, I say to you, all sins will be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they may utter; 29 but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is subject to eternal condemnation”— 30 because they said, “He has an unclean spirit.” Wow, Jesus even says that people who speak again blasphemies will be forgiven… but not those who say that those with the Holy Spirit have an unclean Spirit.
I say this from experience. I love my baptist church and the people where I was saved. However, when I started to notice things from different denominations that seemed to have more life than what I was seeing in my church, I didn’t understand it. At first, I was automatically discharging it because it looked strange to me. However, the Lord told me to be careful who I judge and to be sure to study to show myself approved before I critisize… and as I studied, I found that I was not as “right” as pride and fear told me that I was.
I see that most people that disagree seem to just get deleted, and I’m not here to disagree so much as to point out some areas that are obviously neglected by your writings or that just went unanswered. Based on the peaceful attitude of the previous comments by “YourConscience” and the obviously defensive, yet inadequate, response I would guess that probably the deleted comments just had more questions that your doctrine doesn’t have answers for… though we can’t really be sure with them being deleted to have a truly biblical argument.
I do know that the Word says many in the last days will have a form of godliness but deny its power. I, for one, do not accuse people of having unclean spirits (to heed the warnings of Jesus) unless I can biblically point out point per point from their own teachings that I am right and they are not. So far, this hasn’t been done on your site. If you’re going to accuse people of twisting scripture to fit themselves, you’ll have to more clearly point out where that was done. I see where you have not adequately done so by scripture.
I would love to see serious doctrinal, scriptural facts (not just accusations, heresay, and opinions) refuting the people you have so vehemently spoke against and called evil though. I’m sure they would as well… as I really know only a few people who keep their beliefs when they KNOW they’re wrong.
Seriously, the only reason for these topics to be deleted is out of inadequate preparation and wisdom to respond.
Grace&Peace
>> indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with Fire: Matthew 3:11 —- Question mainly, if fire is all from satan, what the fire that John is speaking of?
You quote half a verse and misunderstand the Bible completely.
Matthew 3:11-12
11 “I baptize you with water, for repentance, but the one coming after me is more powerful than I am – I am not worthy to carry his sandals. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.
12 His winnowing fork is in his hand, and he will clean out his threshing floor and will gather his wheat into the storehouse, but the chaff he will burn up with inextinguishable fire.”
So what we have here is a verse to supposedly back up the anointing by fire that so many pastors and false Christians and now New Agers like to quote to catch the fire anointing.
But let me show you something; this fire is seen in a bad way in the above verse. John says that Jesus will baptize you with the Holy Spirit (for believers) and fire (for non believers) NOT the Holy Spirit AND fire or the Holy Spirit IS fire. John carries on saying that Jesus will gather His wheat into the barn BUT BURN UP THE CHAFF with unquenchable fire, that would be in HELL. Fire is judgement!, Jesus saves those who accept Him (the real Jesus that is) and judges those who DON’T.
You need to make sure which Jesus you are following! The only way is to SEARCH the Word of God for answers and believe me EVERY ANSWER you need is in there. If you seek you will find, if you want to know the truth you WILL find it.
>> For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence. Acts 1:5 —- Again, this is showing a clear baptism with the Holy Ghost… and the disciples were told not to leave until they had received this. Also, Jesus told them that this would empower them. and then you quote (Acts 8:14-19, Acts 9:17-20, Acts 19:1-6, Acts 11:16-17)
Please read the following articles:
Speaking in Tongues has CEASED to understand that all the miracles and powers given to the Apostles by Jesus Christ and passed on was a temporary solution until such time as the bible was written. Then these things ceased.
Are Prophets for Today or has Prophecy Ceased?
Important!! Understanding biblical prophecy Joel 2 and Acts 2: Your Sons and Your Daughters Will Prophesy, But Not Yet
>> Seriously, the only reason for these topics to be deleted is out of inadequate preparation and wisdom to respond.
LOL
This is just a general statement to anyone concerned. Read the Bible for Yourself and Trust not the thoughts and opinions of others. As people we often try our best to understand these things and no person, preacher, or minister can be certain if they try and intepret the Word.
The Word is to bring you to see the Truth for Yourself if you Read it. Some times Miracles and the Presence of the Holy Spirit is a hard thing to explain. There is no surprise over history God blessed certain Prophets with Miracles to show people and to reveal the existence of God to them. The rest is an individual journey and to each his own.
One thing I do know is this very important aspects of scripture given to us:
Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. Matthew 7:1-2
Brethren, let every man, wherein he is called, therein abide with God. 1 Corinthians 7:24
For every man shall bear his own burden. Galatians 6:5
So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God. Romans 14:12
And when one knows this they know what is true Baptism…
In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ: Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead. And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; Colossians 2:11-13
For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. Hebrews 4:12
For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God. Romans 2:28-29
whoever this deb is……please loose your PRIDE and your judgement. They are not from God that much i am convinced of. I have not finish reading all comments yet but will. I am not sure any thing yet expect God’s WORD and the narrow path are my guides. I have much more to see before i discern, But when you said i will allow this comment. My spirit said ouch!!!! Yes spirit my spirit we all have one. GOD is our director not you!!!!!! MAYBE you wont publish this one but my purpose is not shame you but to gently correct you. I love you and so does GOD. Thank you for your efforts….as i have said am taking my time and will not convict one way or the other until i am without doubt. both sides are very convincing. I need to actually take these scriptures and see what beliefs were twisted according to the word. When i read my bible i have to read whatis before and after the verse quoted follow subject and object. This can take time.Deb can you please explain Mathew 3:11 to me.
Kristee
Thanks for insulting me, much appreciated. Where did I insult you? eh? No where. Have you been baptized by the false holy spirit that you do not know the REAL Holy Spirit of the Bible?
It’s not difficult to explain Mathew 3:11, I have an article on it…. when you read the Bible, read the whole passage and not just one verse to get understanding. Now don’t get all upset after reading my explanation ok? You asked for a Biblical explanation and you are getting one, put YOUR pride aside and pay attention to God’s Word.
Fire of The Holy Spirit – Judgment or Anointing?
This is not an easy topic. I would suggest that the issue of the Baptism of the Holy Spirit as a second experience is debatable and am sometimes perplexed as to why the Lord allowed scriptural support for both points of view,(at least, by my reading). But rather than enter the debate or even share my point of view and experience, I’d like to offer a scriptural criterion for judging spiritual activity and prophets who are false; that is, as the Lord told us when warning of last days deceptions:
“15 “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. 16 YOU WILL KNOW THEM BY THEIR FRUITS. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles? 17 Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them.”
The fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, gentleness, faithfulness, and self-control.” If these qualities are at the heart of a ministry which clearly represents the Deity of Christ, His atoning death and bodily resurrection,then it is likely that the Lord is at work there. I feel saddened by the intensity of this theological contention as I’m personally convinced that there are many serious and loving Christians on both sides of the debate. By way of conciliation I’d like to suggest a title for any interested in a discussion that is conducted in an attitude that conforms beautifully with the above mentioned spiritual fruit: THE BEAUTY OF SPIRITUAL LANGUAGE, by Jack Hayford; and close with a prayer that all the Lord’s people who truly love and are called by Him will be protected from every deception and wile of the enemy.
wondertome
>> the Lord allowed scriptural support for both points of view,
Um, no. God does not allow view points for Christianity and Paganism.
>> The fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, gentleness, faithfulness, and self-control.” If these qualities are at the heart of a ministry which clearly represents the Deity of Christ,
You forget about sound doctrine. First you need to preach the Truth, then comes all these things. False doctrine also produces fruit (looks good on the outside but inside it’s rotten) they are lies and people are swept away by them.
>> By way of conciliation I’d like to suggest a title for any interested in a discussion that is conducted in an attitude that conforms beautifully with the above mentioned spiritual fruit: THE BEAUTY OF SPIRITUAL LANGUAGE.
What is ‘spiritual language?’ I do know that the ‘truth’ is? Do you? So, basically what you are saying in your comment is that you want us to agree with your view point. It does not work like that here. We are not Emergents.
I have to believe that you are a very young Christian and a very young woman/girl. Why do I believe this? First off your spelling is atrocious. We all type too fast sometimes but hon, it is not LOOSE your pride. It is lose your pride. Then you accuse “who ever this Deb is” of being judgmental. Every time when truth is presented those who don’t like it accuse the truth giver of judging. That argument is too, too old. What will you do with this verse Kristee? John7:24 Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment. Those are the words of Jesus Christ so be careful what you say when He says judge righteous judgment. Then in these verses Jesus said, Matthew 7:16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
Matthew 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. Want to guess what that means? When we look at fellow Christians what type of “fruit” are they producing. If I look upon an apple tree before I pick a apple I judge the fruit. Here is when we cannot judge. Romans 2:1 Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things. For example if I were to judge a fellow believer for coming to church drunk and said all sort of bad things about them but then I came to the church drunk too, then I would be inexcusable in my judgment.
I want to suggest to you that you buy yourself a very good dictionary and use it. Then a Matthew Henry Commentary. When you prepare to study your Bible I hope you have a very reliable version. But always pray before you read and ask the Holy Spirit to lead you into all truth. Never take just a couple of verses to base your whole belief system on. You will end up taking those verses out of context. This is how scripture must be taught: Isaiah 28:9 Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts.
Isaiah 28:10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little: I will not explain those two verses to you. Read and study them for yourself with a prayer to the Holy Spirit.
If you are as young as I think you are you must learn that a young woman/young Christian must never rebuke an elder woman. 1Timothy 5:1 Rebuke not an elder, but intreat him as a father; and the younger men as brethren; 1Timothy 5:2 The elder women as mothers; the younger as sisters, with all purity.
Grow in grace and knowledge of the Lord. Until you do, just read over the many articles on the web site. You just might learn truth…even if you don’t like it. Deborah’s teaching is very correct.
kristee wrote:
Deborah, I knew of some women in Florida that called tongues their “angel talk” and they just couldn’t talk to the Lord in any language except their “heavenly prayer language.” Oh Good Grief! Most women can’t control the tongue in their mouths much less another one. If you took women out of the false tongues movement it would die a quick death. Every time tongues were spoken there were MALE JEWS PRESENT and it was languages with the sole purpose of winning people to Jesus Christ. You and I and all truth lovers know this my friend. But satan is running rampant and laughing at the false tongue churches.
Deborah (Discerning the World) wrote:
Cat, I hope and pray that you are no longer in the church you mentioned. You should run as fast and as far away from that place. If you continue there you could very well end up being deceived. I too pray that I will never be deceived. Stay in the Word and ask the Holy Spirit himself to lead you into all truth. Make sure you have a very reliable version of scripture
John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
Cat wrote:
It is a easy topic if you know and love the Holy Spirit. The Baptism of the Holy Spirit is not a “second event.” Here is a verse of Scripture that proves truth.
Romans 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
Do you see that? If any man have not the Spirit of Christ (which is the Holy Spirit), he is none or not His. How can a person say or even worse teach, I just received Jesus as my Savior but the Holy Spirit will indwell me at another time. Not according to the above verse. Even Christians are susceptible to being deceived. That is why Jesus warned His Disciples Matthew 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
Mat 7:16 Ye shall know them by their fruits… Jesus didn’t warn the lost world about the wolves; He warned all of us who know and love Him. That tells me that it is possible for Christians to be deceived.
Now, as far as a “Spiritual Language.” Where in scripture does it say something like, “And I shall give my followers a spiritual language so you can talk to me.” Where does it say “Heavenly Prayer Language? Here is what James, the half-brother of Jesus, said about the tongue. James 3:6 And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity: so is the tongue among our members, that it defileth the whole body, and setteth on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire of hell.
James 3:7 For every kind of beasts, and of birds, and of serpents, and of things in the sea, is tamed, and hath been tamed of mankind:
Jamess 3:8 But the tongue can no man tame; it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison.
Last night I was reading in the book of Acts where Paul was standing before Agrippa and he was permitted to speak for himself. He related to Agrippa his salvation experience while on the road to Damascus. I noticed something very interesting in his oratory concerning him seeing and hearing Jesus.
Acts 26:14 And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.
God spoke to Paul in Hebrew. Paul knew other languages; but his “native tongue/language” was Hebrew. There was no “heavenly prayer language” imparted to Paul. God created (at Babel) and knows every language and dialect on this planet!
Here is a verse of scripture that is sooooooo misunderstood by those that think they must speak in some gibberish when talking to God. Romans 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.
There have been a few times in my life that I was under such stress, such physical, mental and emotional anguish that when I would try to pray the words just would not come out of my mouth. But I did groan and cry. It was then that the Holy Spirit himself interceded for me to my Father in heaven. I didn’t have some gibberish come out of my mouth. Nothing would come out of my mouth.
Human nature is that man thinks he is smarter than God. Man wants to believe that we are in control of our human destiny and potential. (New Age garbage) All the way in the Garden of Eden satan made a statement to Eve that he is still saying today, “Yea hath God said?” Eve fell for it and so does the lost world and even some in the saved world think they know that God didn’t really mean what He said. Well yes, He did.
It is also in our old nature, the flesh, to want to feel good. We desire new experiences thinking it will make us closer to God. Faith is not about feelings and experiences. When we received Jesus as Savior, the Holy Spirit came in to live in us. We then at that moment have all of God that we are going to get. But the real question is are we letting God have all of us? This is why we are, as True Christians, to grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord. How do we do that…get into, dig into the Word of God. He has given us every thing that He wants us to know and experience for now and that is in His Word. There is no “New Revelation.” There is no new “Fresh Anointing.”
Look here at what the Apostle John said, 1John 2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him. This anointing we received of Him and it abides in us.
The Christian life is not about us. It is absolutely all about Jesus Christ. When we get to heaven every thing there that has been created will be for us. But until that day we press on in truth for the cause of Christ. Act 17:28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.
Peace to you, His peace.
wondertome wrote:
I went to this church. I heard the music and thought wow! This is amazing stuff. I saw people behave in a very strange way. Barking, screaming, hooting laughter and body shakes. The preacher got up and proclaimed ‘ this is god’. I could feel sexual vibes. At first I liked it because it was kinky. Some of the woman said they would pray for me and a few days later I could feel their prayers. Deep in the heart of my being. I was having these sexual vibes gush out of my inner being. I deeply loved this experience as it was like or it was spiritual sex. The single woman who were both physically fit and beautiful were the best. As they could pray with more energy. Iwould know when they were praying for me as it felt like we were joined and I think they were enjoying it to because it went on for a long time. It was beautifully forefilling and completely spiritual. Spiritual sex pleasure beats the real thing. But there was something wrong. I didnt know why but it just started to hurt inside for no reason and the inner part that was feeling so zappo started to hurt and I started to get really confused. Hugs in church from the woman started to become more passionate and while I enjoyed the intimate touch, I wondered if they knew I could feel their parts. I knew this was wrong. But I wasn’t the one who was pressing my body against theirs.i was getting squeezed physically. I felt the right thing to do was to put out my hand for a hand shake greeting but even this type of touching became an act of sensuality. I felt it was strange that they would not let go of my hand but would continue holding me.being new to church I guess I didnt want to hurt their feelings..I would always be trying to look at Godd but was and I would be crying out inside and sayinv to God whg are you hurting me. I stopped going to church and I didnt let any of those people touch me. I started to get so angry at God. Their music was so beautiful but I was feeling so unclean inside. I felt so cheated anx robbed because I so .much wanted to believe that God was who he said he was. But I new deep inside my heart this was not God. I dont even know how I got to this pages. But when I read I thought hey I know about that stuff. Its happened tl me
I have been a prominant minister in the fire, anointing, for many many years. Featured on stage with all the big names. One day I got a book that was anointed. I suddenly realised that was the anointing I got in South Africa. It was the real Holy Spirit and I saw myself with a very dark black spirit in me. I have shut down the ministry. Went thru hell, my husband has left me. I have fasted till I cant I can not get this spirit out of me. I know I am under falsehood. Can people pray for me please, I am scared, unclean, unholy and have falsehood in and on me. Can I hook up wiowth people that know how to break this. AM DESPERATE
Mary Smith,
Hi Mary, the first thing we need to do is for you to tell us what happened in South Africa when you received the so-called anointing and from whom. We also need to know the title and the author of the book which you said was anointed.
GraceAndPeace wrote:
Is it possible that those who were living by the fruit of the spirit or that were living by the law of Moses were the one that Jesus was storing in the barns? And the He meant that those that were corrupt or living sinful lives or had no knowledge of God at all were the ones that He was going to burn up with inextinguishable fire? After all when Saul had his conversion it wasn’t until Ananias prayed for him, laying his hands on him that Saul received the Holy Spirit and became Paul who then was on fire for the Lord, wasn’t he? Everyone in Acts who came to believe and received the Holy Spirit and began fellowshipping and caring for one another, selling belongings, praising God, speaking in tongues and others understanding, etc… My point being and as a reminder I say this…Jesus did not go to the homes of the Holy and Righteous, no, He went to the homes and places where He was needed most. To the sick, the sinners, the Samaritan’s, the Gentiles, et.
That’s all
Thanks
No, Jesus did not only visit the sick, the sinners, the Samaritans, the Gentiles, etc. He came and died for everyone.
First of all, the bible is the only book that needs to be read, not man’s opinion as this is. You do receive the Holy Spirit when you accept Christ as your saviour. That is the Spirit within, acts is talking about the spirit upon, which comes upon you with power to do the works of God, which is also evident throughout the old testament, when the “spirit came upon them” to do the work of God, the holy spirit with in, will teach you and guide you. No need to read man’s opinion which this is. The Spirit upon is also known as the Holy Ghost which has been taken out of most translations of the word of God accept the KJV.
Mary Smith
Are you still around? Please answer us.
This book, do you still have it? If so please tear it up and throw it away. Along with every other book you have, pamphlet, workshop docs, CDs, DVDs, everything (excluding the bible of course) tear them up, break them and throw them away.
Secondly, I want you to stop fasting, you are making your mind weaker and weaker that you can’t spiritually fight off this demonic force.
Thirdly, I want you to make a list of every sin in your life, that includes your ministry that had a FALSE FIRE (demonic force) over it. List all the books you have read and every minister that has laid hands on you and transferred this so called ‘holy spirit’ over you. Please try remember them all. IF you can’t remember them all it’s ok, Jesus knows you have tried.
Once you have made your list Mary I want you to pray”
Start listing your sin (books, personal life, ministry, people who laid hands on you, false baptism, speaking in tongues, everything) one my one and ask Jesus to remove ALL demons from you and break ALL chains of demonic force over your life. Mention that any sins that you did not mention because you forgot about them, Jesus must please deliver you from them and break all chains over you. Afterwards thank Jesus Christ for your deliverance and saving your life:
If you need to say that following:
Say this with confidence, as Jesus Christ has already won the battle and because you are now a child of God, that battle has been won for you and you have the authority to use Jesus’s name. Keep saying this until all demonic manifestations have left your home.
Thank Jesus Christ from the bottom of your heart and worship him through thanking Him for what He has done for you – Start reading your bible (not other books)
Some here make it sound like we should have no feelings of our senses concerning the Holy Spirit. I see the dangers of inviting demons and being deceived. Christ indeed Baptized with the Holy Spirit. I do not conform to the belief that the first sign of Baptism of the Holy Spirit is speaking in tongues. Actually the strange Fire was the first sign. That was an apostolistic sign and was done at the time the Holy Spirit was sent down to us this generation. so I can understand the position that this is not a sign to be repeated. But Spiritual gifts have not stopped with the apostles. I refer you to
1 Corinthians 12 written by Paul. Here is the first few verses please read Chapter before and after and the whole of 12 for context.
1 Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant. 2Ye know that ye were Gentiles, carried away unto these dumb idols, even as ye were led. 3Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.
4Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit. 5And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord. 6And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all. 7But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal. 8For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit; 9To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit; 10To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues: 11But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.
was john g lake a false healer and false prophet, i have people when they prayed for me say i speak healing in jesus name, i did not fell any miraculous healing when they said that, they seem to think if they call things that are like healing it will manifest, is this biblical or false doctrine, i have also had people tell me martial arts from satan which i think they are full of crap, number one i took martial arts and we did not worship the kung fu school i trained at , we do not get power to break bricks from demons like some people believe, they develop the ability by hitting a striking post called a makiwara wrapped in rope or by hitting their hands aginst bags filled with beans, gravel, or steel shot, and over time your bones calcify and become denser and harder, look up the term murphy’s law on the internet and it explains this, we don’t practice witchcraft or black magic, i had people at benny ministries when i called their prayer line years accuse of witchcraft fro praying to god a girl i like start liking me as a boyfriend and people in the word of faith movement like benny hinn and kenneth copeland minstries call this “witchcraft prayers”,they are so full of crap, many of them operates in a spirit of witchcraft themselves when benny at his fake miracle crusades said ” i curse that man or wom that dare speak out against his ministry, they are speak out against him because he is a dam con artist in sheeps clothing, there are video on youtube on benny hinn saying this at one of his fake miracle crusades, and operates in a spirit of witchcraft when they manipulate the bible bible where it says in the bible don’t touch gods anionted and they misquote and take out of context that bible verse to instill fear in their followers and use and abuse ti to manipulate their followers, their is a woman who used to be a house keeper that wrote a book called “Mafia Ministry named cheryl brown i believe, who exposes benny hinn and his family and steve munsey, and she was spiritually abused by benny hinn and his family and ministry, go on google and type the name of the book “Mafia Ministry” and it will tell you where you can buy it, and my advice to people, go on background checks websites and do get a background check on all these word of faith preachers that scam people, one of them has a drug related offense on his criminal record, i also know that richard roberts, the son of oral roberts was arrested for drunk driving a couple of years ago and it showed a mug shot of him arrrestede for drunk driving, go on youtube and type rchard roberts arrested for drunk driving, and pastor randy white alseo arrested a couple of years ago for drunk driving, and don’t dare tell me this time don’t touch or qustion gods anointed richard roberts, may the lord rebuke these fake counterfeit anointed men of god who act like they are superstars and bigshots
John McMasters
Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. (Mat 7:21-23)
robbie gareau
>> was john g lake a false healer and false prophet,
Yes he is a false teacher, he formed the Apostolic Faith Mission here in South Africa.
>> i have people when they prayed for me say i speak healing in jesus name, i did not fell any miraculous healing when they said that, they seem to think if they call things that are like healing it will manifest, is this biblical or false doctrine,
It’s false, this is no where to be found in the bible.
>> i have also had people tell me martial arts from satan which i think they are full of crap, number one i took martial arts and we did not worship the kung fu school i trained at , we do not get power to break bricks from demons like some people believe, they develop the ability by hitting a striking post called a makiwara wrapped in rope or by hitting their hands aginst bags filled with beans, gravel, or steel shot, and over time your bones calcify and become denser and harder, look up the term murphy’s law on the internet and it explains this, we don’t practice witchcraft or black magic,
I’ve already answered this. If you don’t want to believe that there is a demonic force behind all martial arts then there is nothing anyone will do to change your mind. You have been told the truth about martial arts by many Christians and you don’t want to listen.
>> i had people at benny ministries when i called their prayer line years accuse of witchcraft fro praying to god a girl i like start liking me as a boyfriend and people in the word of faith movement like benny hinn and kenneth copeland minstries call this “witchcraft prayers”,they are so full of crap,
There is nothing wrong praying to God asking Him to help you find a wife, however praying to God to ask Him to make a girl like you is not right, you may as well go to a witchdoctor and get him to cast a spell for you over the girl you like that she returns the feelings. God wont make someone like you because you want them too like you. He will however sent the right girl to you that you need not want.
Michael wrote:
Well written … well worded ! Thanks ! Inspirational!
Bardi,
Would you say that when Jesus said the following he was referring to a perfect faith?
Hi Can you explain what John the Baptist meant when He said this in Matthew 3:11 “I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire”:
And Can you please explain what Happened to the Apostles in the Upper room on the day of Pentacost?Acts 2:3 to 13.Can you please rerad this as its lenghty.
I had Holy Spirit experiences.How do you know its real or not?
You say baptism of Fire is unbiblical but there it is in the Bible.Bless you.
Lorenzo
I would appreciate it if you could first explain what you mean by “I had a Holy Spirit experience” and then we can go from there. Were you slain in the spirit when you had this experience? Did you begin to speak in tongues. Give me a little more info, please.
Lorenzo
Please read: Fire of The Holy Spirit – Judgment or Anointing?
I know that Kudalini is a demonic spirit that has nothing to do with the Spirit of God. The enemy will always counterfeit the things of God to bring confusion or to have of put down and not operate according to how God has ordained his Body to.
That being said I don’t understand how any Lover of Christ, Bible believing Christian can believe that the power of God does not operate today. That is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. God the same yesterday, today and forever. Just because we cannot wrap are little minds around the fact that God can use us and choose to manifest himself through us does not mean that His power is not in operation today. Some of you are just like the Pharisees calling what is of God ungodly. They did the same thing to Jesus when He operated in power by casting out demons, healing the sick, etc. They said He was operating under the influence of Satan. A religious spirit will always deny the existence and power of God. It is always those whose relationship is based totally on head knowledge that have a problem with tapping into the Spirit of God.
I still have not seen you give an answer to scripture that was posted regarding the Baptism of the Holy Spirit. As usual when someone post those scriptures there is always the cry of you are misintepreting the scriptures or “twisting scriptures” or they post scriptures totally unrelated to what was being posted and try to get off topic instead of fully addressing what scripture says.
May God open your eyes of understanding and help you see beyond the natural and see with spiritual eyesight.
Regina
>> That being said I don’t understand how any Lover of Christ, Bible believing Christian can believe that the power of God does not operate today.
That is a WOF lie, of course it operates, you go to Jesus Christ in prayer, you do not go to a faith healer. Do you have a problem with going directly to Jesus Christ in prayer?
>> I still have not seen you give an answer to scripture that was posted regarding the Baptism of the Holy Spirit.
What scripture? Please quote it.
Regina,
You readily agree that the devil and his demonic spirits are able to counterfeit the Spirit of God but refuse to acknowledge that we must test the spirits? Really??? How does that work for you? By the way you have given yourself away when you said, “It is always those whose relationship is based totally on head knowledge that have a problem with tapping into the Spirit of God.” “Tapping into the Spirit” is totally, indubitably, unadulterated New Age teaching. The Bible does not say “Renew your ability to tap into the Spirit of God.” It says,
Your mind is your head knowledge which you glean from Scripture. Where did you learn this garbage – from Rodney Howard-Brown, Benny Hinn, Kenneth Copeland or another heretical teacher in the WOF Movement?