At Boshoff from CRC Church shows us how Pharisees went about ‘Honoring’ God
The recent invitation to debate sent to Mr. At Boshoff by Dion Knoesen was as a result of the below notice sent out by CRC, to their members and undersigned by Mr. Boshoff.
This notice was dated 16 November 2010 with the Subject: “Honour God”
We wish to state the reason for the intended debate with Mr. Boshoff. We hope to either persuade Mr. Boshoff to give heed to proper rendering of the Scriptures for his own benefit and also to benefit those who are under his shepherding.
1Ti 4:16 Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee.
On the CRC website it s mentioned that Mr. Boshoff studied at “A Bible College” for three years fulltime. Unfortunately no name is given to this Bible College.
In the last paragraph on this webpage the it says the following:
“He has been described as focussed, passionate and fervent in his hunger for the Word of God and explosive in his dynamic teaching of it. His positively dynamic and practical messages are equaled in their refreshing relevancy to their bold authenticity and doctrinal accuracy. “
When looking exegetically into his notice “Honour God” we have to question his “authenticity and doctrinal accuracy.”
For informative purposes the quoted Scriptures by Mr. Boshoff is discussed below in RED
As Paul wrote:
Php 1:9 And this I pray, that your love may abound yet more and more in knowledge and in all judgment;
Php 1:10 That ye may approve things that are excellent; that ye may be sincere and without offence till the day of Christ;
Email sent out from CRC Church to it’s congregation:
From: CRC Christian Church
Sent: 16 November 2010 01:00 PM
Honour God
“Money is the answer to all things.” Ecc 10:19
The two most important books in your life are the Bible and your cheque “book”. The Bible is the revelation of God’s love for us and our cheque book is the revelation of our love for God.
In Joshua 7 we read about the only place where Israel failed when they crossed into the Promised Land. The only place where Israel suffered defeat because they tampered with the gold and silver (the devoted things) that belonged to God.
Your tithe is Holy to God. Lev 27:30. There are two principles that dominate throughout the Old and New Testament: First fruits get given first and; seed time and harvest. It is God’s purpose that should drive us to give.
In Acts 5 we read about Ananias and Sapphira that financially stood in the way of God’s purpose and suffered great calamity. God does not curse you; your actions open your life to either failure or success.
Does Jesus endorse tithing? Of course He does. In both Matt 23:23 and Luke 11:42; Jesus says that tithing should be the most basic thing. When you tithe you shouldn’t even see that 10 percent. It’s God’s. Also we read in Heb 7 that tithing was before the law. It was a part of the Abrahamic covenant that still exists and is fulfilled in Jesus. He tithed to Malchizedek (high priest) 430 years before before Moses came with the law.
Your allegiance, your tithe, should be given to the church where you are planted. Mal 3 speaks about the coming of Jesus and actually the Holy Spirit. In this we see that we should bring the tithe to the “storehouse” which is your church. Give to God what is God’s. It is God who should be honoured first because He is the source of all your income. Matt 22:17-21
We work to build the kingdom of God, we shouldn’t work to meet our own needs. People can frustrate the work of God by withholding resources. Let’s evaluate ourselves and rectify places where maybe we’ve neglected to honour God with our finances. If you start today it is never too late.
This past week-end we saw 470 people giving their lives to Jesus. We are here to possess the Promised Land. Thank you to every one of you for working hard throughout the year and inviting your world to CRC.
We had a fantastic harvest event in Cape Town last week. We saw the entire auditorium filled to the max. Ps. Aidan and Sharon are doing a great work in that city. I believe many good things are still heading our way in Cape Town.
They have begun to lay the foundations for the Pretoria Building Project. We are so excited to see how things come together as we follow the instructions of God. As we are now in the time when we have to pay the contractors large sums of money every month, I urge you to give the money you pledged or whatever extra the Holy Spirit lays on your heart.
If you still want to contribute please e-mail finance[at]crc.org.za
The Kids’ Party is only a week away. Please take part in this as we are going to make the day special for over 15 000 underprivileged children. If you would like to volunteer or make a donation please contact 051-xxx xxxx.
Be Blessed,
At Boshoff
A Critique on how to “Honor God” written by At Boshoff – Critique notes in red
“Money is the answer to all things.” Ecc 10:19 (Undersigned by At Boshoff)
[Note: It is utterly disappointing to notice that Eccl. 10:19 is cited and interpreted in the way At Boshoff has done so in his notice to the congregation at CRC.
When reading what King Solomon wrote in the book of Ecclesiastes the basic understanding and proper rendering of the Scripture quoted is in fact quite the opposite, as indicated here by Mr. Boshoff.
The passage in context from the first verse (In fact the first chapter of Ecclesiastes) has to do with what the foolish do and the evils resulting from their actions in this world, which also includes verse 10.
Solomon’s message is one of vanity to all that are under the sun, which includes “Money is the answer to all things” What Solomon actually means in writing this is that man’s trust in money which according to man answers all things, is vanity. Their trust and security should be in God and not in money.
It is vanity of fools who rely on their money for all things instead of God.
Psa 62:8 Trust in him at all times; ye people, pour out your heart before him: God is a refuge for us. Selah.
Psa 62:9 Surely men of low degree are vanity, and men of high degree are a lie: to be laid in the balance, they are altogether lighter than vanity.
Psa 62:10 Trust not in oppression, and become not vain in robbery: if riches increase, set not your heart upon them.
Psa 62:11 God hath spoken once; twice have I heard this; that power belongeth unto God.
Mar 10:24 And the disciples were astonished at his words. But Jesus answereth again, and saith unto them, Children, how hard is it for them that trust in riches to enter into the kingdom of God!
1Ti 6:17 Charge them that are rich in this world, that they be not highminded, nor trust in uncertain riches, but in the living God, who giveth us richly all things to enjoy;
1Ti 6:18 That they do good, that they be rich in good works, ready to distribute, willing to communicate;
1Ti 6:19 Laying up in store for themselves a good foundation against the time to come, that they may lay hold on eternal life
Why do so many pastors not put their faith in God but rather exploit the people, after all they are always accusing those who do not have money as being without faith – yet when they need the money they rely on the people instead of their faith??
The Bible does not teach that money should not be used to preach the Gospel and to support brethren (not organisations) in the body of Christ – it is very obvious that mammon should be befriended for this purpose.
But to contort Scripture in this manner shows doctrinal ignorance – hopefully – that rather done so on purpose.]
The two most important books in your life are the Bible and your cheque “book”. The Bible is the revelation of God’s love for us and our cheque book is the revelation of our love for God. (Undersigned by At Boshoff)
[Note: Where is this revelation in the Bible, that our cheque book is the revelation of our love for God??
The revelation I find is that our love for the Lord Jesus, is to keep His commandments not the love of filthy lucre. Our love is manifested in our obedience to Him, our trust in Him alone not in mammon and riches.
There are only two important books and that is the Bible and having your name written in the Book of Life.]
In Joshua 7 we read about the only place where Israel failed when they crossed into the Promised Land. The only place where Israel suffered defeat because they tampered with the gold and silver (the devoted things) that belonged to God. (Undersigned by At Boshoff)
[Note: Ouch!!! First of all it was not Israel who “tampered with the gold and silver” but one man named Achan the son of Camri who had stolen some of the spoils of looted booty of Jericho. (This also had nothing to do with his own money, silver or gold or any of his personal belongings which is referred to here Mr. Boshoff in quoting Joshua 7 for gaining money from New Testament congregants.)
Yes, Israel as a corporate entity was punished as result of the theft by Achan, but it had absolutely nothing to do with the personal wealth individuals were given by God, which were then somehow to the interpretation of this part of Scripture withheld from God.
Firstly this was in disobedience to God, because God placed a ban on personal gain from the looted goods.
Secondly theft was the cause of the punishment – taking things not given to you by God.
Thirdly it was the covetousness of Achan that was addressed in the punishment. Covetousness is what God warns us against throughout the Scriptures.
A reminder: The Bible does not teach that money should not be used to preach the Gospel and to support brethren (not organisations) in the body of Christ – it is very obvious that mammon should be befriended for this purpose.
But to contort Scripture in this manner shows doctrinal ignorance – hopefully – that rather done so on purpose.
To be under the shepherding of someone who does not understand context and doctrine or does understand context and twists it out of context, is not promoted by Scripture:
1Ti 4:16 Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee.]
Your tithe is Holy to God. Lev 27:30. There are two principles that dominate throughout the Old and New Testament: First fruits get given first and; seed time and harvest. It is God’s purpose that should drive us to give. (Undersigned by At Boshoff)
[Note: Some more doctrines lacking regarding the tithe very applicable to the Old Testament. Using this one verse for the purpose of tithing is not sufficient and there were many tithing’s applicable not just one. To understand this tithe there were basically 4 types of tithing in the Old Testament ONLY
a) The tithe to the Levites. Deut.14: 27.
The Levites were the “government” of Israel and due to them not having a share in the land allocated to the rest of the tribes, those allocated land were to use of their produce to give to the Levites.
b) The tithe of the Levites to the Zadokites. Neh.10: 38.
Now this is where Malachi is used to place unnecessary burdens on believers today.
First of all, tithings were purely laws given in the Torah or Old Testament. So commanding and condemning people to tithe today by quoting Malachi 10, is basically going back to the Torah or the Law, putting congregants back under the law.
Secondly the Scriptures used below to state that Jesus endorses tithing are totally out of context with regard to tithing and God’s Word in fact it refers to this as works by the Pharisees to justify themselves, something God loathes. In Fact God says woe to them that tithe! – will explain when we discuss these passages.
Thirdly when Malachi 3:10 is read and understood in context it refers to the tithe in a) above, the tithe in Deut 14:27 which was received from the tribes and given to the Levites. The Levites in turn were to skim off a tithe from this tithe (Neh10:38) to give to the priests attending to temple duties. So it was the Levites who were robbing God not the people.
It is interesting when reading the “Works Of Josephus” the Sadducees were the rich of the day who were using the tithes to enrich themselves. Josephus admits to this as he himself was a Sadducee.
Historically it is proven that the Sadducees were extremely rich due to the financial contributions by ordinary people who were forced to pay tribute.
There is no new thing under the son. Today’s Sadducees and Pharisees apply the same rule. The flock enriches them as result of their own rendering and contortions of Scripture.
The clergy were robbing God of tithes not the people, hence the rebuke to them in Malachi 10.
Have any of the Malachi 10 promoters ever read the following to any of their congregations?
Mic 3:10 They build up Zion with blood, and Jerusalem with iniquity.
Mic 3:11 The heads thereof judge for reward, and the priests thereof teach for hire, and the prophets thereof divine for money: yet will they lean upon the LORD, and say, Is not the LORD among us? none evil can come upon us.
Mic 3:12 Therefore shall Zion for your sake be plowed as a field, and Jerusalem shall become heaps, and the mountain of the house as the high places of the forest.
The third type of tithe:
c) The tithe toward the annual Holy Days. Deut. 14: 22 – 26.
3 Times a year the Israelites were to attend Holy Feasts at Jerusalem and for this they needed to set aside a tithe of their harvests etc. If they were too far from Jerusalem they could sell the targeted tithed articles and turn it into money. This they would spend upon themselves and the Levites once they arrive in Jerusalem.
d) The tithe to the less fortunate. Deut.14: 28 – 29.
This is also a tithe to obviously assist the needy in the Old Testament.
Although a tithe in the New Testament is never mentioned in this regard there are many Scriptures which clearly say that the needy ought to be cared for.
When one searches for the word “Tithe” in the New Testament there are two references one in Matt. 23:23 and the other in Luke 11:42 which notably is quoted by Mr. Boshoff and will be discussed.]
In Acts 5 we read about Ananias and Sapphira that financially stood in the way of God’s purpose and suffered great calamity. God does not curse you; your actions open your life to either failure or success. (Undersigned by At Boshoff)
[Note: Who is man that he is able to stand in the way of God’s purpose? Is God dependant on man?
Psa 8:3 When I consider thy heavens, the work of thy fingers, the moon and the stars, which thou hast ordained;
Psa 8:4 What is man, that thou art mindful of him? and the son of man, that thou visitest him?
It is agreeable that one’s actions open you to success or failure, but to use Acts 5 as yardstick for failure and success is totally out of context.
I know of many people struggling financially who humbly adores God and has extreme credence in the Lord Jesus, but who realize that their own actions caused their calamity. Those being poor and suffering financially in this life without rejecting the Lord Jesus who are willing to endure to the end will be first in the Kingdom.
Although there are certain quotations by the MHCC I do not fully agree with the MHCC renders the following understanding with regard to Ananias and Sapphira which I could not have worded better:
The sin of Ananias and Sapphira was, that they were ambitious of being thought eminent disciples, when they were not true disciples. Hypocrites may deny themselves, may forego their worldly advantage in one instance, with a prospect of finding their account in something else. They were covetous of the wealth of the world, and distrustful of God and his providence. They thought they might serve both God and mammon. They thought to deceive the apostles. The Spirit of God in Peter discerned the principle of unbelief reigning in the heart of Ananias. But whatever Satan might suggest, he could not have filled the heart of Ananias with this wickedness had he not been consenting. The falsehood was an attempt to deceive the Spirit of truth, who so manifestly spoke and acted by the apostles. The crime of Ananias was not his retaining part of the price of the land; he might have kept it all, had he pleased; but his endeavouring to impose upon the apostles with an awful lie, from a desire to make a vain show, joined with covetousness. But if we think to put a cheat upon God, we shall put a fatal cheat upon our own souls. How sad to see those relations who should quicken one another to that which is good, hardening one another in that which is evil! And this punishment was in reality mercy to vast numbers. It would cause strict self-examination, prayer, and dread of hypocrisy, covetousness, and vain-glory, and it should still do so. It would prevent the increase of false professors. Let us learn hence how hateful falsehood is to the God of truth, and not only shun a direct lie, but all advantages from the use of doubtful expressions, and double meaning in our speech.]
Does Jesus endorse tithing? Of course He does. In both Matt 23:23 and Luke 11:42; Jesus says that tithing should be the most basic thing. When you tithe you shouldn’t even see that 10 percent. It’s God’s. Also we read in Heb 7 that tithing was before the law. It was a part of the Abrahamic covenant that still exists and is fulfilled in Jesus. He tithed to Malchizedek (high priest) 430 years before before Moses came with the law. (Undersigned by At Boshoff)
[Note: Is Mr. Boshoff rightfully dividing the Word here?
To understand Matthew 23:23 effectively one needs to read from verse 1!
These were the Words of the Lord Jesus Himself. The Lord Jesus was warning against the Pharisees and rebuked them for putting credence or weight to their tithes. The Lord Jesus says in Matthew 23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
The Lord Jesus most certainly does not say that tithing is the most basic thing in this Scripture. In fact He says woe to those that tithe and ignore the important things that God wants. The Lord Jesus in fact says that it is NOT the most basic thing. He says the “weightier” matters are more basic than the tithe.
Luke 11:42 Again out of context and basically the same rebuke goes out to the Pharisees who promoted and relied on tithing as the basic thing at the time of the Temple in Jerusalem.
I do not find: “Jesus says that tithing should be the most basic thing” What I do find is another rebuke to the Pharisees and Scribes who felt very secure in basic tithing: Luk 11:42 But woe unto you, Pharisees! For ye tithe mint and rue and all manner of herbs, and pass over judgment and the love of God: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
What I have found in CRC when I used to go there was that they were promoting security in tithing, but the more important and weightier matters such as keeping the Lords commandments in our love for Him, I personally never heard in any sermon by Mr. Boshoff.
Is this not precisely why the Lord Jesus in His Word rebukes the Pharisees?
In Matthew 23:23 and Luke 11:42 the focus is more on the “weightier” matters than the tithe.
A very repetitive part of Scripture used by Mr. Boshoff is Hebrews 7
Gen: 14:18: And Melchizedek king of Salem brought forth bread and wine: and he was the priest of the highest God.
Gen: 14:19: And he blessed him, and said, Blessed be Abram of the most high God, possessor of heaven and earth:
Gen: 14:20: And blessed be the most high God, which hath delivered thine enemies into thy hand. And he gave him tithes of all.
This is to “prove” that tithing was established before the time of Moses, the Torah or law and that tithes have to be given to the priest. To find out what the Melchizedek tithe meant one has to not only read this passage, but also read on to verses 22 & 23.
From verse 18 – 20 it is clear that this was not Abraham’s belongings which were tithed, but rather the booty or loot he had gathered from conquering the enemy.
Gen:14:22: And Abram said to the king of Sodom, I have lift up mine hand unto the LORD, the most high God, the possessor of heaven and earth,
Gen: 14:23: That I will not take from a thread even to a shoe latchet, and that I will not take any thing that is thine, lest thou shouldest say, I have made Abram rich:
Although he gave away 10% of the booty, he stated that he did not even want any of it, because it was not his.
It is also interesting to note that this was a ONCE OFF event, which never took place again.
Ninety percent and more of Scripture quoted for the purposes of pleading for tithes are taken out of context today. God says let few be teachers, because those teachers teaching the flock will be held accountable for what they teach.
A reminder: The Bible does not teach that money should not be used to preach the Gospel and to support brethren (not organisations) in the body of Christ – it is very obvious that mammon should be befriended for this purpose.
But to contort Scripture in this manner shows doctrinal ignorance – hopefully – that rather done so on purpose.
James:3:1: My brethren, be not many masters, knowing that we shall receive the greater condemnation.]
Your allegiance, your tithe, should be given to the church where you are planted. Mal 3 speaks about the coming of Jesus and actually the Holy Spirit. In this we see that we should bring the tithe to the “storehouse” which is your church. Give to God what is God’s. It is God who should be honoured first because He is the source of all your income. Matt 22:17-21 (Undersigned by At Boshoff)
[Note: Reading Mal 10 from verse 1 rather suggests that the audience addressed by God were the priests as already discussed. The “storehouse” is definitely not the New Testament church. The New Testament church is the bride of Christ and not a building built with brick and mortar.]
We work to build the kingdom of God, we shouldn’t work to meet our own needs. People can frustrate the work of God by withholding resources. Let’s evaluate ourselves and rectify places where maybe we’ve neglected to honour God with our finances. If you start today it is never too late.
[Note: The Lord Jesus calls for heed to doctrine rather than finances and I do hope that Mr. Boshoff would rather be obedient to the Lord in the weightier matters.]
This past week-end we saw 470 people giving their lives to Jesus. We are here to possess the Promised Land. Thank you to every one of you for working hard throughout the year and inviting your world to CRC.
[Note: Figures do not impress God. One such an example is: Exo 23:2 Thou shalt not follow a multitude to do evil; neither shalt thou speak in a cause to decline after many to wrest judgment:
Mat 22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen.
The quote Mr. Boshoff uses in Matthew 23 was discussed already and to conclude, using this verse as a basis for endorsing tithing is basically in support of what the Pharisees promoted – That Mr. Boshoff is teaching here and to the congregation is absolutely the same what the Pharisees were doing.
What is important however and of grave concern, are the proselytes made by CRC. This is also found in Matthew 23 the chapter in which the verse occurs that Mr. Boshoff uses to preach the diametric opposite to what the Lord Jesus says in this chapter: Mat 23:15 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.
Mat 23:16 Woe unto you, ye blind guides, which say, Whosoever shall swear by the temple, it is nothing; but whosoever shall swear by the gold of the temple, he is a debtor!
Mat 23:17 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold?]
We had a fantastic harvest event in Cape Town last week. We saw the entire auditorium filled to the max. Ps. Aidan and Sharon are doing a great work in that city. I believe many good things are still heading our way in Cape Town.
[Note: I suppose it is not worth mentioning all those pastors and lay persons who have left CRC and would like to see Mr. Boshoff repent of his ways.]
They have begun to lay the foundations for the Pretoria Building Project. We are so excited to see how things come together as we follow the instructions of God. As we are now in the time when we have to pay the contractors large sums of money every month, I urge you to give the money you pledged or whatever extra the Holy Spirit lays on your heart.
If you still want to contribute please e-mail finance@crc.org.za
The Kids’ Party is only a week away. Please take part in this as we are going
to make the day special for over 15 000 underprivileged children. If you would like to volunteer or make a donation please contact 051-525 2883.
[Note: It is agreeable that feeding under privileged Children is a very good work, yet the concern remains what these poor children are being fed spiritually when such doctrine as discussed here is being preached.
Hitler once said that if the hearts of the children are won, the next generation will be won.
It is also fact the “Church” of Rome has built a multitude of schools and hospitals and proclaims ex-Cathedra that winning the minds of children before age 7 will ensure that they will be won permanently for the Mother “Church”. I see the same happening at CRC so feeding children is an outward appearance coaxing them into a greater deception of being taught wrong doctrine
Remember what James wrote; if the correct faith is dead the works mean nothing.
It is the correct doctrine that will ensure the correct faith – this is why the works may be more detrimental to the children in the longer term.]
Thank you Chris!!!!
Petrus my dear dear friend, If you only knew of the great number of people who have suffered as a direct result of having followed pulpit money preachers like At Boshoff (in his case yes, many from his own BFN based congregation have suffered and suffered extensively), then you would perhaps learn that unless you are able to provide Mr Boshoff with your money at a regular and constant basis, you are of no use to him and his personal objectives.
Why not request a public meeting with him and ask him to explain what your money buys for him and his cronies? Why not be a real man and demand such a public meeting with him? Come on I challenge you to do this! He has been ducking and diving my invitation to meet on a public platform for almost two years now; I wonder why…perhaps you, as one of his loyal followers could convince him to meet so as to suggest that those who speak out against his false teachings “could be put in their place”.
Is such a public platform not a good, solid, sure platform form him to use to ensure that people like me for example, could be addressed in our continuous attack of the great muscleman? Please take up my challenge and ask your money preacher to respond to some questions so many wish to pose to him…please I beg of you, please. You see my friend, he never will respond. He does not have the courage of his conviction… Sadly, it seems that neither have you. Or am I wrong?
Dude,
I believe you when you state that ‘people pay allot for this stuff’. The world indeed pays allot for folly and tickling of the ears…
Like Rick Warren & Co, you mix worldly pop-psychology, marketing and business with the Word of God. This blog (correct me if I’m wrong Debs), are not a social-friendly, seeker-friendly site. It’s also not to promote what we believe to be the truth of God, it’s rather to promote as you rightly stated, the Acts 17:11 approach, and only God and His Word can be and is Truth…hence these posts only confirm what already transpires in the Word of God.
We are not interested in starting a movement or an army – but to live out Jude 1:3! I’m involved in strategy myself, and from a professional and secular point of view ‘social engineering’ does not belong in the work or business environment as it’s tactics involve manipulating people, exploiting human vulnerabilities, and influencing groups of people. These tactics border on CULT like methods and techniques; you will be welcomed by promoting your pop-psychology to Mormons and Jehovah Witnesses.
True social engineering in a sense is being able to measure ecology by means of standardised scientific based assessment scales; based on FACTS – help individuals, groups, and organisations to make their OWN choices by giving them a holistic view of their social-anthropology. Since you’re not able or qualified to perform the above mentioned; please do not continue to psychologise, manipulate and brain-wash individuals into your thinking.
Reading a few books at the local store does not make one an expert in sociology, but reading a few books at the local supermarket on pseudoscience, and believing that you are an expert = ignoramus, bungler, cretin, and dullard!
Ps At this and Ps At that….that is the only thing you guys can complain about. You quote scriptures and point fingers..I’d just like to know how much money did you collect for the poor in public? How many people have you introduced to Jesus? This man of God doesn’t care what you are thinking/saying about him, he is busy leading +/- 49,000 people and if every single person asks him a question online, when will he get time for me or people like me? How many lives are you changing while complaining and moaning about his holidays ect….if you want to ask him something, you know where he is on Sundays.
I don’t care, he can be on holiday 24/7, he has done enough for someone else to take over and keep it going. Why can’t he be blessed with holidays / cars / whatever? Or would you like him to suffer for everything CRC has accomplished? Have you ever been on holiday? Do you own a car?
It doesn’t matter how much money you give to a church or to people in need, keep your money for all I care….it’s between you and God. I like to give my 10% (or whatever) and to go to church because it is one thing the devil can’t take from me. If they didn’t build churches, I wouldn’t be where I am today. I don’t know much about the Bible, honestly, I just choose to give money to help other people like me (and if mine is used for food or a plane ticket to where ever – I don’t give a shit)
Just one question (and it doesn’t matter if no one answers it because I won’t be back to read the reply as I stumbled upon your “website” by accident): If Ps At is such a bad person and CRC such a bad church, why has God done nothing to stop him? Why do people keep giving their lives for Christ (even the few that doesn’t become members eg. my mother, my friends)
Ps At doesn’t rule me and he keeps reminding in church that he’s just a man like us, maybe if you went more you would have heard this. It is NOT about what you can get/have on earth, if your not happy, talk to God about it, why moan in public (behind your computer…you know where the churches are) If they didn’t keep asking for money, how many churches would be build/rented or how many prisoners would be listening to someone to change their lives? That prisoner that gets saved might be the one that is not going to kill your wife/husband.
I’m a sinner, just like any human, but as a new man saved by Christ I’m shaking my head at you self centered words and I will be praying for you. Do yourself a favor and take the Bible out of your ass…and since I’m still in a struggle to leave my old ways, here is something from my past: (and before anyone quotes a scripture, I know it, but still..) Go fuck yourself
Kind regards,
A young man that loves Jesus!
William
Well now, ain’t that just nice of you. Fantastic calling card!
A product of At Boshoff’s ‘saved‘ church goers – I shudder to think how many more there are like you. I suppose its expected that you will turn out like this because you don’t know your bible – all you need to do is go to a church, tithe and do good works to be ‘saved‘ by At Boshoff
Hi Deborah!
I notice how defensive At Boshoff’s followers are and how their true colors are now being exposed also. We can do no more than pray for these unfortunate blind who are led by the blind.
I wish some of them would heed my constant invitation to convince At and his cronies to meet upon a public platform to debate their doctrine and their theology.
Clearly, their current doctrine determines their idea of theology as opposed to the way it should be.
Oh how sad it is to learn day-by-day just how much the world is deceived and how much they need God in their lives.
Hold fast my friend.., hold fast.
Regards.
Ps. I note that Petrus and Dude have now gone quiet….., or have my hopes gone a little too high?
Williamc
Product of At?… great “testimony” William… for you and AT. Oh and no need to explain your lack of biblical knowledge. It is evident in your comment and interpretation what you think the Gospel should be..
Why do people curse and swear? – one reason: authority. People want to sound forceful and authoritative when they speak, so they spice their speech up with all sorts of catchy little “power words”. Unfortunately, such words always dishonor God, the Bible, and the Lord Jesus Christ.
Friend, TRUTH is all of the authority you need. Just read and compare the truth here as it is revealed in God’s Word and you’ll have no use for “Christian cursing”.
Remember: “But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment.” (Mat. 12:36)
Ephesians 5:4 – Let there be no filthiness nor foolish talk nor crude joking, which are out of place, but instead let there be thanksgiving.
Ephesians 4:29 – Let no corrupting talk come out of your mouths, but only such as is good for building up, as fits the occasion, that it may give grace to those who hear.
Colossians 3:8-10 – But now you must put them all away: anger, wrath, malice, slander, and obscene talk from your mouth. Do not lie to one another, seeing that you have put off the old self with its practices and have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge after the image of its creator.
Colossians 4:6 – Let your speech always be gracious, seasoned with salt, so that you may know how you ought to answer each person.
Colossians 3:8 – But now you must put them all away: anger, wrath, malice, slander, and obscene talk from your mouth.
Matthew 12:37 – For by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned.”
Philippians 4:8 – Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things.
And then there is holy living… but let us take one subject at a time – we will do holy living next time.
Shame Willem,
You do not love Jesus – you love yourself! Grow-up little boy!
Titus 1:16 They claim to know God, but by their actions they deny him. They are detestable, disobedient and unfit for doing anything good.
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Job 5:3 I myself have seen a fool taking root, but suddenly his house was cursed.
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Psalm 37:35 I have seen a wicked and ruthless man flourishing like a green tree in its native soil,
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Isaiah 29:13 The Lord says: “These people come near to me with their mouth and honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. Their worship of me is made up only of rules taught by men.
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Jeremiah 3:10 In spite of all this, her unfaithful sister Judah did not return to me with all her heart, but only in pretense,” declares the LORD.
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Jeremiah 11:17 The LORD Almighty, who planted you, has decreed disaster for you, because the house of Israel and the house of Judah have done evil and provoked me to anger by burning incense to Baal.
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Jeremiah 45:4 [The LORD said,] “Say this to him: ‘This is what the LORD says: I will overthrow what I have built and uproot what I have planted, throughout the land.
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Ezekiel 17:5 “‘He took some of the seed of your land and put it in fertile soil. He planted it like a willow by abundant water,
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Ezekiel 33:31 My people come to you, as they usually do, and sit before you to listen to your words, but they do not put them into practice. With their mouths they express devotion, but their hearts are greedy for unjust gain.
God never spoke of quantity rather quality, so why do you mention 49 000+ people, this has no significance? Error + Error = HERESY!
And, please, why does God not stop him? Why does God not stop rapes, murders etc? Go figure, we live in a fallen world my boy, so don’t try to justify the unjustly with questions you do not know the answer too.
Read your Bible and get saved!
Hi Deborah
What my Mom always said about people who talk like this is ….that they are just low class. He thinks he is saved writing like this … you go figure!!
Anyhow they don’t understand what is going on. Why? because they don’t want to. Talk about ignorance is bliss. They love all this ‘happy clappy’, I am much more precious, holy, saved than you. Besides I tithe and do some good works and come out of church on Sundays feeling such a ‘happy chappy’. I just know I am going to the right church, even if I swear like a rubbish.
Here is the test they should try. Go to your Pastor and tell him you are broke and could the church please give/lend you some of that money. Just until you come right and are ‘blessed’ like him.
See what I mean about dropping a ‘brick’. But in this case it is more like a tank.
Beverley
In His Grip
Willem
You seem to be throwing stones in a bush without really knowing what you are doing. To make a statement to the effect of how much money we collected from the public for the poor shows exactly what the problem is…….. you have no idea!
You have absolutely no clue as to what we have given personally, not relying on begging from the public, but from our own hard work to earn a keep. We do not rely on heavy shepherding from the flock who are self in need, instead we give to God’s flock who are in need. In Many such instances we have given to those who lost a lot of money due to tithing to CRC. Where were you to help your own flock when they sought the protection and help from your pastor and did not get any help….Mmmm?
No! We had to help your crippled flock, not you!!!! Where were you???
You are absolutely correct in saying that we quote Scriptures – well that is the authority on which we rely. Jesus is our authority and it is ONLY by His Word that we preach and warn.
How many lives are we changing……… well you will have no idea as Jesus is the Saviour and only He knows by the seeds we have planted and others have given water too. God is the one who brings the increase not me, not you and most assuredly not At Boshoff.
One thing is for certain and that is through the grace of God that MANY who were in a cult like CRC have tested the Scriptures we have quoted hence MANY have come out of CRC – PRAISE THE LORD! So there goes your bad attitude towards quoting from Scripture.
It has absolutely nothing to do with who has a car etc. All I deduce from this is that you live in your own little world and need to wake up and realise there are other true believers who have more money that your pastor, but this is not by what a person is measured by. Go Read Luke 12:13-21 and don’t be an aggressive ignoramus.
You ask that if CRC is so bad why does God allow it to go on………well Satan has been around from before CRC and God has not stopped him yet…… but the day of judgement is closer than what you think…..you had better gain knowledge very soon by studying the Scriptures.
Having said that – you and your pastor may still have time to repent, unfortunately this grace seems not to extend to Lucifer.
I am quite glad that you have admitted that you are a new believer…… I can now understand that you are not yet able to be on meat…….but my prayer is that you will go study your Bible.
To render bad concepts towards God’s Holy Word as you have done here is blasphemy and I do really pray that you will prayerfully read the Holy Writ and be in a position to expound the Scriptures which will complete your salvation.
1Ti 4:16 Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee.
Do not flatter yourself and brag about before you were saved and think that will intimidate anyone……you will be amazed who you are trying to scare……but we do not walk as murderers, drunkards etc anymore.
You are by your own admission still a baby not even understanding the milk and you are totally ill equipped to fight the good fight so put on the armour first otherwise you are going to get hurt – spiritually speaking.
What is of concern here is that the sheep (you) are protecting the wolf in sheep’s clothing (At Boshoff) who is the supposed shepherd who should be protecting the sheep.
Where is the Shepherd in all of this????? Instead of going on holiday he should be out contending for the faith and take up the challenge to debate (we have requested this from At Boshoff numerous times) or must the sheep and little lambs, that is in your case Willem, protect the shepherd????
Debs I will not be answering little babes like this anymore as it is a total waste of time they have absolutely no Scriptural sense and in fact a person like Willem who still uses a worldly way of arguing makes me wonder if he in fact was saved as the fruit of the Spirit as well as the Word of the Lord is absent in his efforts.
The only thing we can pray for is for these people who so fervently protect their pastor will with the same fervency study the Scriptures.
2Ti 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
2Ti 2:16 But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.
P.S. I can understand that a fowl word might come accidentally to some, which is bad enough, but to actually take the time to print these words shows you what the result is of salvation in CRC. You should keep these postings as it should be a deterrent to those who want to get” saved” there.
If I was At Boshoff I would tell his church to not speak on his behalf because they prove that he is a false teacher.
Chris
Thanks for your fantastic reply to Willem.
I hope he comes back to read it. Let’s pray that if there is any Holy Spirit conviction in his life, the Holy Spirit convicts him to come back and read the replies. He needs sound teaching in his life because he sure as nuts is not getting it at CRC.
Hi Dion
It’s terrible isn’t it. And all we can do is pray for them. That their blind eyes are opened to the truth.
The world is so deceived and it’s getting worse and worse and worse to the point that the gospel of Jesus Christ isn’t even preached anymore – its all GOOD WORKS instead. Good works has become the benchmark to prove ones salvation. If it makes you feel good, then then you must be following Jesus, therefore you must be ‘saved’. It’s all in the heart.
I think Dude and Petrus are not coming back but then again, I’ve spoken too soon sometimes lol.
I agree with Debs, Chris…
I though of David slaying Goliath for blaspheming God’s army.
yea ok… i thought of a sling and a pebble too
Yip something comes to mind – Salvation Terminator starring Arnold Schwatzernegger or rather Salvation CRC starring At Boshoff.
Robbie – I am all for the sling and pebble … right on!! Terminator is great as well, as long as we get the job done. I thought dropping a brick on their head was a good idea, but now I pefer the above ideas.
Beverley
In His Grip
The contention regarding the doctrine of Mr. Boshoff is not to be taken lightly. There are many who have lost a much when realizing what CRC and Rhema really is about, but often too late.
There are many, fortunately not all, but many who after getting hurt in CRC who have been so disappointed that they blame God for what has happened.
It is due to the seriousness of blaming God after such big disappointment that I would like to call those who got hurt back to follow the Lord Jesus.
Understandably some without the proper understanding may react by blaming God, after all God is love so how is it then that God has allowed this deception in those who have such a zeal for goodness and His love?
As Paul wrote concerning Israel: Rom 10:1- 3 Brethren, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved. For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. For they being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
This righteousness of God is only revealed in the Gospel: Rom 1:16 -17 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
Having the righteousness of God being revealed in the Gospel it is obvious that we should study this Gospel and give credence to the doctrine in this Gospel then ONLY do the just live by faith. That now is where faith is identified and understood.
Our faith is not faith in positive thinking as the world sees it (We should however follow the Biblical way with a correct rendering of positive attitude), but our faith and faithfulness is revealed in the pages of the Holy Word. The more you study the more you realise your errors and the more the Word leads you.
Even those who then have a zeal for God as in Romans 10, but not according to knowledge are in danger of deception. As Jesus warned the Pharisees: Mat 22:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.
In the pages of the Bible there are many warnings to take heed against deceivers, false prophets, teachers etc. who are out to mislead God’s flock. If this misleading was not possible then the warnings the Lord and His Apostles gave us are in vain.
If these deceivers were not to increase in the latter days then the Lord has lied to us which is impossible with God.
In fact if we do not obey the Lord God’s Word and we do not love the Truth which is His Word a deception is inevitable; 2Th 2:10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
2Th 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
Salvation continues after you have been saved – the Lord promised that He will continue a good work in those who are saved but obviously freedom comes to those who CONTINUE in the Word and obey the Word.
Yes, and the Lord Jesus also said that when He leaves us the Comforter He (The Spirit) will lead us into all that is true – but then we need to follow His Spirit and be obedient.
Interestingly His Spirit is the Words spoken by Him – Joh 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
So the more obedient you are to His Word the more the Spirit will lead you – No wonder the Psalms teach us that His word is a lamp to our feet – hence being guided by His Spirit.
If we are not lead by this Lamp we WILL go astray AND SOME OTHER SPIRIT WILL BE LEADING US!!
Remember the Lord gives His Spirit to those who are obedient: Act 5:32 And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him.
Those who are rebelliously disobedient will have another Spirit leading them; Eph 2:2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
The Lord has given us the Scriptures which is the true prophetic Word and in this Word He has warned us to study the Word and obey the Word to be able to walk in righteousness and in truth.
So if we have not studied the whole Council of the Lord, obeyed this Council and then were mislead, we dare not blame God but ourselves – we were forewarned by Him.
If you are in a congregation where a pastor has backslidden or fallen but has a repentant heart, restore him in meekness, but if he is rebellious and has no repentant heart and does not listen to righteous council withdraw from such.
My heart’s desire is for Christians who were hurt by “churches” and pastors to return to the pages of the Bible, because in them you will find the Lord’s guidance which will when obeyed lead you righteously away from error to set you free in the Truth.
My plea is for those who rejected their faith as result of getting hurt by others to return to Jesus the only true Shepherd.
May God’s grace be extended to you and heal you.
>> There are many, fortunately not all, but many who after getting hurt in CRC who have been so disappointed that they blame God for what has happened. It is due to the seriousness of blaming God after such big disappointment that I would like to call those who got hurt back to follow the Lord Jesus
Indeed, we can’t blame God for the evils of men for it is Satan who is behind all that is evil.
And I speak from experience, just when I got saved, I didn’t know the Word of God at all, I met a ‘church’ and it is here where I lost a LOT of money to a ‘smooth talking so-called godly man’. When I realised what had happened, I NEVER once thought to blame God, no… My reverence for Jesus Christ to not turn my back on Him was far greater than the astounding amount of money that I lost. I got on my knees and asked Jesus for help.
You see God had been warning me the whole time, but I didn’t listen to Him. He was there for me all the way waiting for me to wake up and LISTEN TO HIM. It was my fault.
Now it’s a lesson learnt like non other.
CRC’s motto is bothersome to me: “I WILL, I CAN”. it sounds like they still need to do a lot of ‘dying to self’.
Deborah the same thing happened to me and my family.
But I was so angry after that I cried out to Lord and said “What is wrong with those people, why did You let me find and stay in that church”.
A still small voice said to me … “because YOU loved it so, you had itching ears”. I sulked for something like 8 years I was hurt, confused and really, really angry. I had been so duped and ofcourse it was all God fault. What now!
Eventually I came around after a wonderful man brought me correct teaching that also pointed out about wolves in sheep’s clothing. All that kept coming to me was …”so did you learn anything, from your experience”. I was so set free.
I believe that it had to happen, it was all part of a learning curve. Now I just thank God, He allowed it to happen. I keep asking God why am I so blessed, why am I able to see so much when others are so blind. I now believe I had to learn, walk through the fire so to speak, to get to where I am today.
I believe many people will be challenged in this way, the thing is will they turn away and follow the real Jesus. This is the test.
Beverley
In His Grip
HI THERE FELLOW BELIEVERS,
GOING THROUGH ALL THE COMMENTS AGAIN, IT BOGGLES MY MIND HOW ALL THESE SAVED PEOPLE STAND UP BUT HAVE NO KNOWLEDGE OF THE WORD OF GOD. I WAS ALWAYS CONCERNED WITH THE FALSE PROPHETS AND THERE ARE MANY, BUT THEN THIS VERSE CAME TO MIND
2Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
2Ti 4:4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
2Ti 4:5 But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.
THE THEY ARE CHURCH MEMBERS, CONGREGATION, PEOPLE IN THE CHURCH THAT ARE LOST GATHER FOR THEMSELVES THE AT BOSHOFF’S. RAY MCAULEYS, ECT.
THANKS FOR GOOD WORK YOU GUYS ARE DOING.MAY GOD BLESS AND REWARD YOU GREATLY.
Bevelery
>> I keep asking God why am I so blessed, why am I able to see so much when others are so blind. I now believe I had to learn, walk through the fire so to speak, to get to where I am today.
That is a very good question. Why is it that some like you and I and many others out there can see the truth (sometimes it takes a while, but eventually we do see) and then there are others who just refuse. Is it because back then, deep down we really did love Jesus Christ unlike others who refused the truth? Is it that our love for our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ is for real where others love is not.
Something I have been thinking about lately… why do some love Jesus and hear the truth and others dont…
Thanks Michael
God always has a remnant. My faith walk took a detour many years ago into the so-called charismatic renewal which included some WoF and the old PTL Club which hindsight showed me was an ecumenical mish-mash straight from the pit.Why did I see the light while others who I tried to pull from the fire did not? I know folks who remained were genuinely saved, but they would not accept the hard facts and the truth.
One has to have a love for the truth above all else and I think that is where many go astray. Yes, Bev we should consider ourselves blessed in a humble way that we were delivered from the snares of the enemy. The years you spent in the desert prepared you for the lonely road you must travel if you truly follow God and Him alone.
I am thankful for the work that the Lord has called Deborah to as it is so needed today, not only to try and reach the deceived, but to provide encouragement to those who count the cost and take the lonely road rather than the one most traveled. It helps us realize that although we are lonely, we are not alone in the world. Often we feel disconnected and although we cling to our Saviour’s promise never to leave us or forsake us, we still feel the slings and arrows of the enemy and those who hate us for our stand for truth. It makes us long ever the more for our Lord to come for us. But until then we must press on and run the race set before us. At times I feel as if I am crawling rather than running! 🙂
>>>… why do some love Jesus and hear the truth and others don’t…<<<
Must have something to do with a narrow road and a very small gate Debs.
Michael my friend,
Pursuant to your comment the other day, this is what Lord Francis Bacon had to say in his life (1561 to 1626) “Men prefer to believe what they prefer to be true…” Then there was a certain Edmund Spencer and English poet who said :”There is a principle which is against all information, which is proof against all argument and which cannot fail to keep man in everlasting ignorance, that principle is condemnation before investigation…”
Is it not heartbreaking and gutwrenchingly true of those who defend false prophets like At Boshaff and his ilk, locally and internationally? Deborah, Chris and so many others like them should be carried on our shoulders and should be supported in the work they’re doing in defending the Truth. They will one day get their reward from God I know, but while we are able to support and encourage them in their very demanding task, we should.
You too my brother, should be encouraged to defend the Faith and stand strong and endure to the very end when God will welcome you into His presence in heaven!
Keep your eyes upon Jesus, look full in His wonderful face….
Hi Deborah,
My theory on why others don’t want to “hear” the truth is because it will require an action on their part. Most prefer to “go along to get along” because the other option is to confront and be persecuted. In this way they are only serving man, not God. What they don’t realize is the amazing growth in their walk with Jesus Christ they can experience when they defend HIM instead of worrying about their earthly comforts. As hard as it is I can think of no greater honor than to defend my Lord and Savior. Our society today pushes post modernism so much, we mistakenly think it applies even within the walls of our own churches.
Thank you for your website. I just used your vast amount of information to discuss a couple topics my college aged son asked me this weekend. You are a blessing to my family.
The answer to WHY “…because THEY received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.” (2 Thes. 2:10b-12)
Secondly, it also takes humility. Jesus said, “Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child shall in no wise enter therein.” (Matt. 18:17) If we are proud, and “have all the answers” and no need to confess that we don’t and are in need of the teaching of the Spirit who leads us into ALL truth – well – “When pride cometh, then cometh shame: but with the lowly is wisdom. The integrity of the upright shall guide them: but the perverseness of transgressors shall destroy them.” (Prov. 11:2,3)
at least Benny Hinn is carrying the great mandate of going to all nations preaching the gospel.Instilling fear and confusion to people poinitng false prophets,,who does it help?the gospel is good news yes Jesus said it to warn those already saved those who actually received the good news.Who are you helping with all this?Would a sinner come to Jesus through this?
The reason why some cannot see nor hear the truth is because of judgement!
2 Thessalonians 2:11 For this reason God will send upon them a deluding influence so that they will believe what is false,
Romans 1:26 For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural,
Whatever THEY want, believe and see, is what THEY will receive!
Be careful what you wish for, it might become true!